Duxford September Airshow 2016- 10th and 11th September

Re: Duxford September Airshow 2016- 10th and 11th September

Postby cuban8 on Fri 16 Sep 2016, 9:37 am

The only suggestion that might make a difference is a temporary closure of the westbound A505 (no traffic from the M11 roundabout) from say 1630 to 1830. At least cars exiting DX (only allowed to turn left, of course, from the main site) will be unhindered by traffic control during peak movement of exiting cars. Won't be popular with the locals, but if it was well advertised beforehand, then people will be able to make arrangements to avoid or whatever.
We never rush away after the show, and on Sunday we wandered back to the car near the American Museum at 1900 and were out on the A505 within 10 minutes. We were staying in Cambridge, so the journey to our accomodation via the back-roads was no problem, although if we had to travel south via the M11, it would have been a different story, given the state of the London-bound traffic that remained at a stand-still when we looked at 1830.
Thought the show on Sunday was excellent (we gave up at 1530 on Saturday) and enjoyed the FoD enclosure's facilities as usual - many thanks again to the volunteers, who in my experience, do a top job and often have to deal with some awkward members.
It's been a time of upheaval for the DX airshows, but I think things are, in general, going in the right direction. I believe their management are learning lessons (in some areas) and hope they continue to take on board the concerns of their customers and act accordingly wherever they can.
We all want to see DX succeed, and whilst it'll be an impossible job to please everyone, a reasonable balance of tastes can be achieved and the majority will feel they've had value for money, and will keep coming back for more. The recent big 'Duxford spectaculars' that have led to chaos will have to be reconsidered and their viability on the site as it stands should be questioned.
Ignore the very concerns that have been expressed here and elsewhere, or make the cost of airshows at DX beyond what the ordinary punters and families regard as affordable for them......... and we're in for trouble.
cuban8

Re: Duxford September Airshow 2016- 10th and 11th September

Postby Thoughtful_Flyer on Fri 16 Sep 2016, 10:26 am

strangelookingalien wrote:Me too.

Duxford handled the weather excellently on Saturday - with the taxying jets being an excellent addition. They have nothing to compensate for in regards to weather as its a risk we all take with outdoor events.

I would, however, welcome compensation for yet another terrible piece of traffic management at the end of Sunday's show. I can only imagine they were relieved to have the excuse of an accident to blame on the chaos - despite the fact it is regularly just as bad. Year on year I complain to Duxford about this on deaf ears and all it does is make me more inclined to watch from outside. I decided to buy tickets to support the airshow this year because they booked the Sea Vixen. Unfortunately on Sunday, while I really enjoyed the flying, Duxford failed yet again in so many small ways revealing that the management care about selling you tickets - but very little else.


It is easy to moan about the traffic "chaos" but I have seen very few positive and viable suggestions. Ultimately all of the exits are onto a busy single carriage way A road.

The east end is very close to the M11 junction and that is a mixed blessing as if the motorway backs up for any reason it gridlocks the exit.

The west car park exits are sensibly restricted to a left turn only. Unfortunately selfish people try their best to get round that by doing U turns in every farm entrance and side road which impedes the traffic flow.

Duxford do all they can to limit cars by charging for parking (which seems to wind people up on here out of all proportion) and providing reasonably effective free shuttle buses from stations and park and ride sites.

It seems to me the biggest single improvement would not be to have the star attractions on at the end of the show. A significant number of people would then drift away during the last hour or so.
Thoughtful_Flyer

Re: Duxford September Airshow 2016- 10th and 11th September

Postby Slappywag on Fri 16 Sep 2016, 11:33 am

Thoughtful_Flyer wrote:
strangelookingalien wrote:Me too.

Duxford handled the weather excellently on Saturday - with the taxying jets being an excellent addition. They have nothing to compensate for in regards to weather as its a risk we all take with outdoor events.

I would, however, welcome compensation for yet another terrible piece of traffic management at the end of Sunday's show. I can only imagine they were relieved to have the excuse of an accident to blame on the chaos - despite the fact it is regularly just as bad. Year on year I complain to Duxford about this on deaf ears and all it does is make me more inclined to watch from outside. I decided to buy tickets to support the airshow this year because they booked the Sea Vixen. Unfortunately on Sunday, while I really enjoyed the flying, Duxford failed yet again in so many small ways revealing that the management care about selling you tickets - but very little else.


It seems to me the biggest single improvement would not be to have the star attractions on at the end of the show. A significant number of people would then drift away during the last hour or so.

Got to have a star item in the first place...
Slappywag

Re: Duxford September Airshow 2016- 10th and 11th September

Postby Dragon Rapide on Fri 16 Sep 2016, 11:39 am

Thoughtful_Flyer wrote:

It seems to me the biggest single improvement would not be to have the star attractions on at the end of the show. A significant number of people would then drift away during the last hour or so.


I would agree with most of your post but I am not sure the Balbo would work half way through the Legends afternoon! Added to the fact that I guess most airshows are told when the stars can perform whatever they request, as a whole days transiting and displaying at different venues has to be scheduled.
Listen to that Gipsy music.....

Dragon Rapide
Dragon Rapide

Re: Duxford September Airshow 2016- 10th and 11th September

Postby Thoughtful_Flyer on Fri 16 Sep 2016, 11:58 am

Dragon Rapide wrote:
Thoughtful_Flyer wrote:

It seems to me the biggest single improvement would not be to have the star attractions on at the end of the show. A significant number of people would then drift away during the last hour or so.


I would agree with most of your post but I am not sure the Balbo would work half way through the Legends afternoon! Added to the fact that I guess most airshows are told when the stars can perform whatever they request, as a whole days transiting and displaying at different venues has to be scheduled.


If that is the only alternative to a couple of hours of gridlock I would regard that as working!

Sunday's show may not have had any choice about the Red Arrow's timing but the 14 Spitfire formations could have been much earlier. Although the Red's were the big crowd puller there are a significant number of enthusiasts who have seen them many times and will give them a miss for the sake of an easy getaway. However, give that they would have waited until the Spitfires landed, with the Reds following directly on it was tempting to stay and watch.
Last edited by Thoughtful_Flyer on Fri 16 Sep 2016, 12:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Thoughtful_Flyer

Re: Duxford September Airshow 2016- 10th and 11th September

Postby Thoughtful_Flyer on Fri 16 Sep 2016, 12:01 pm

Slappywag wrote:Got to have a star item in the first place...


Fourteen Spitfires followed directly by the Red Arrows were, in most people's eyes, two star items.
Last edited by Thoughtful_Flyer on Fri 16 Sep 2016, 1:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Thoughtful_Flyer

Re: Duxford September Airshow 2016- 10th and 11th September

Postby Mooshie1956 on Fri 16 Sep 2016, 12:44 pm

Thoughtful_Flyer wrote:
The west car park exits are sensibly restricted to a left turn only. Unfortunately selfish people try their best to get round that by doing U turns in every farm entrance and side road which impedes the traffic flow.



While I understand what you are saying, I am one of those selfish people that do a U turn but not at a farm entrance but the first side road I come to. As I come down to Duxford from Manchester, being honest I don't really want a 20 mile detour and adding about an hour onto my travelling time home. First time and only time I did that I asked how to get back to the M11 as I wanted to head north to Manchester, follow the signs I was told, I went as far as Royston I think then followed the signs all the way back to the Duxford motorway turn off.
Saying all that what I do nowadays is have something to eat a cup of tea or whatever I can get to drink, loo stop etc, before leaving and the roads are usually clear, usually allowing me to go right straight from the car park.
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Re: Duxford September Airshow 2016- 10th and 11th September

Postby aviodromefriend on Fri 16 Sep 2016, 8:12 pm

aknott68 wrote:The fact is that it is head on and I'd rather here suggestions from people as to how to deal with it other than just take pictures on one half of the airfield - ie pointing at the eastern end.
I remember Hesja wrote a lengthy article about that in the lead up to Radom last year, but apparently it has been removed since then. Pity, as a lot of tricks could also work at other fields that have this sun-problem.
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Re: Duxford September Airshow 2016- 10th and 11th September

Postby TKK 140 on Fri 16 Sep 2016, 11:29 pm

There are things that can be done to improve exit.

1.Direct traffic inside Duxford, meaning marshals to control traffic at the west end, the LH lane is generally slower as those joining the exit queues join from the left. First in, last out in a traffic jam.

2. Build a proper slip road onto the A505.

3. None of the above and be prepared for delays

A must! - turn right at the first opportunity and u turn if coming back easterly. No problem last Sunday, everyone else being long gone.
TKK 140

Re: Duxford September Airshow 2016- 10th and 11th September

Postby strangelookingalien on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 9:21 am

The traffic at the western end near the American museum is normally not managed *at all*. Even this past Sunday there were numerous people forming individual queues and pushing in, driving over the hump to the Land Warfare Hall etc.

While this behaviour is unpleasant - it is basically caused by the fact that the car park near the LWH has to empty fully before any of the other cars leave. This could easily be alleviated by having marshalls forcing the traffic to merge. With the extra revenue generated from the car park passes (a measure which I actually welcome) there is no excuse for not employing a large team of professional car park attendants.
strangelookingalien

Re: Duxford September Airshow 2016- 10th and 11th September

Postby TKK 140 on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 5:39 pm

They did place a couple of people at the land warfare hump exit. Late in the day as the far west car parks had emptied by then.
TKK 140

Re: Duxford September Airshow 2016- 10th and 11th September

Postby FarnboroJohn on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 8:36 pm

strangelookingalien wrote:While this behaviour is unpleasant - it is basically caused by the fact that the car park near the LWH has to empty fully before any of the other cars leave.


I'm not sure where this idea comes from. Clearing that area makes no difference to the gate access for everyone else. We were parked in the area you are talking about, returned late to our car and drove more or less straight out despite the fact that modern police practice appears to involve leaving crashed cars in the middle of the road instead of moving all the debris, including the battered cars, out of the way of citizens not involved in the accident. (Despite the needs of insurance companies and possible court cases, this is sheer insanity. Two clicks with a phone camera and clear up, for goodness' sake.) We were not by a long way the last car out of the area and our access to the exit queues was permitted by generous-minded members of the public already in the queues, probably because we didn't try to force our way in but waited to be invited. I do agree that proper marshalling would help considerably both in actually reducing the time and increasing the sense of things being conducted fairly, which is a great help when one is frustrated.

While I'm on, my three year old nephew Max thought the show was amazing. Unfortunately he has the Red Arrows bug so he thought they were the best thing there (even I will admit it was a good Arrows show and I've been watching them since I was his age) whereas I would be hard put to choose between the 14 Spits, my first Lanc show for two years and the Snipe (first view for me). But chiefly I loved the light - after so much cloud and gloom this summer, Duxford on the Sunday was stunning.

John
FarnboroJohn

Re: Duxford September Airshow 2016- 10th and 11th September

Postby strangelookingalien on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 10:22 pm

FarnboroJohn, I can't imagine we are talking about the same place then since I have been attending Duxford years and parking next to the American hangar (early arrivals car park) and whenever I leave - whether i've sat in the traffic for an hour or driven straight out - the far west car park is ALWAYS empty. They marshall the cars out of there before any of the American Hangar cars have managed to get into that car park.

There were a couple of marshalls, but with hundreds of cars it just will not do.
strangelookingalien

Re: Duxford September Airshow 2016- 10th and 11th September

Postby FarnboroJohn on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 8:27 am

strangelookingalien wrote:FarnboroJohn, I can't imagine we are talking about the same place then since I have been attending Duxford years and parking next to the American hangar (early arrivals car park) and whenever I leave - whether I've sat in the traffic for an hour or driven straight out - the far west car park is ALWAYS empty. They marshall the cars out of there before any of the American Hangar cars have managed to get into that car park.

There were a couple of marshalls, but with hundreds of cars it just will not do.


Lets be certain then: I thought you meant the area on the North side of the Land Warfare Hall, across the tarmac road that runs across the front of it: West of where the entrance booths are put for cars on show days. On Sunday when we got back to the car at about 1830 hrs it was only half empty but traffic was flowing fairly easily on the tarmac in two parallel streams that then merged into one at the gate (enforced by one half of the gates being shut).

The choke point for people parked further in is where the line of trees comes up nearly to the Mulberry Harbour roadway section, where all the people who have sneaked round left and right inside the American hangar car park cram into one or two streams. Once the two streams are sorted and running past the LWH it doesn't take long to get out - though the uncleared accident did cause additional delay.

Cheers

John
FarnboroJohn

Re: Duxford September Airshow 2016- 10th and 11th September

Postby strangelookingalien on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 9:31 am

Yes i'm talking about the area that is further in. I almost always park there and never get out before the car park nearer the exit has cleared owing to the choke point you mention.

The only time i've ever got out of Duxford quickly (aside from this Saturday when there was very few in attendance) was at Flying Legends when we arrived late and parked nearer the exit - past the choke point.

Without pushing in - as far as I can see - its impossible to get out of the deeper car park until the car park nearer the entrance has cleared.

Regardless - time after time Duxford must have been told about this and they still refuse to properly staff the car parks at the end of the day.
strangelookingalien

Re: Duxford September Airshow 2016- 10th and 11th September

Postby DirtyFokker on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 4:07 pm

I can confirm that IWM sent me an email, saying that I will get 30% off an air show next year. Very nice gesture :clap:
DirtyFokker

Re: Duxford September Airshow 2016- 10th and 11th September

Postby strangelookingalien on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 5:42 pm

Did anyone that is getting the discount email get weekend tickets or was this just the on day tickets?
strangelookingalien

Re: Duxford September Airshow 2016- 10th and 11th September

Postby timuss on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 6:37 pm

strangelookingalien wrote:Did anyone that is getting the discount email get weekend tickets or was this just the on day tickets?


I got weekend tickets and havent had the email.
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Re: Duxford September Airshow 2016- 10th and 11th September

Postby nbaker on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 8:37 pm

I had Saturday only tickets and have had the email.
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