May Airshow

Re: May Airshow

Postby NTFC1 on Mon 29 May 2017, 10:33 am

speedbird2639 wrote:
I don't think parents should be penalised on how many children they have


I would be interested to hear why you think people who don't have kids/ choose to attend without their kids should subsidise your entrance price. I'm quite happy to pay a 'fair' price but when a people carrier full of people is getting in for the same price as I'm paying then surely a modest adjustment of the pricing structure is required.

I'm guessing that part of the 'free kids' thing is the hope that kids who are taken to air shows will in turn become paying adults eventually - it would be interesting to see what the 'take up' rate is on that - do the kids become paying customers or do they abandon air shows to do other things in their spare time?

I don't and if you'd quoted the second part of my post you'd see the point i was making.
It's the coach load of under 16's "groups" to 3 or 4 adults not families that abuse this policy.
My kids watch the show and enjoy it so for that reason i would've been happy to pay £50/£60 for yesterday.
The parents who drag along kids who aren't interested might not be so willing
I don't set the prices,am just happy to pay them.
NTFC1

Re: May Airshow

Postby phreakf4 on Mon 29 May 2017, 10:55 am

106500 wrote:All in all a pretty good day yesterday. Of course the absence of the Vixen was massively disappointing but apart from that definitely a good day. Not sure why the Mig 15 went AWOL?....


Just after the Rafale finished its (superb) display, the FDD (or the flight safety committee, not sure which applies) decided to stop the show "due to approaching weather". The pair of Mk 1 Spitfires which were already airborne were "requested" to land. At that point the Spitfire leader became unable to understand the transmissions from "Display"..... they were instructed to change to Duxford Information at which point I, for various reasons which are of no consequence, was not able to change frequency on my scanner and was therefore surprised to see the two Spitfires run in for their display.

I will not speculate on the conversation between the Spitfires and Duxford Information but it was nice to see the very graceful (though mostly a little distant for photography from the Friends enclosure) display from the Spitfires.

I suspect that the decision to stop the show early had more to do with allowing visiting aircraft to depart for home before the weather closed in.
We are Borg:.....Resistance is Fruity...
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Re: May Airshow

Postby Glosterbloke on Mon 29 May 2017, 11:24 am

The call for the Spits to abort their display was due to the RTC on the A505 just to the west of the site, it appears the display director was (quite rightly) concerned about having them overflying the site where the emergency services were trying to do their jobs. Didn't catch the rest of the conversation after the freq change so don't know why they changed their minds.
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Re: May Airshow

Postby tuska2 on Mon 29 May 2017, 2:17 pm

If you arrived over the weekend in the Western car park, between 07:00 and 08:00, you might have been as bemused and frustrated as I was to find what used to be ( for over 20 years ) a pole position for viewing by your vehicle a la Old Warden, to find the view blocked by a funfair, catering (so called ) and
retail stalls, plus a front row of camper vans! When I broached the subject later with a "visitor service" guy, I got a shrug and advice to go and sit by the front!
I overheard others near my parking spot clearly feeling they had been short changed by this inexplicable change - the usual retail "street" only used one side, and positioning the big vid screens at the front is hardly appropriate to an airshow- so for any others who experienced that, how do you feel about it? do you know a good reason for it?
tuska2

Re: May Airshow

Postby ShutterPlane on Mon 29 May 2017, 2:49 pm

Hello all.

Last time at Duxford for me I think was 2015.

I did enjoy my day yesterday at Duxford, but something certainly felt different.

Respect to the RAF, the Typhoon and the pilot flying it, however The Typhoon display I though was not at its best. It was too high, too far away, very tame, mild and un-entertaining.

The rest of the show was ok, but again, a bit mild in places compared with other years.

Breitling Wing Walkers, always enjoy seeing those gorgeous girls and the Red Devils put on a fantastic show, especially flying the flag.

Armee De L'air with their Rafale wiped the floor with the RAF's Typhoon display and certainly put on a significantly better show. For a start, I could see it as it was nearer and lower. Secondly it was much more full of awe and power.

Shame about the Sea Vixen crashing on Saturday, as I would have loved to have seen that.

But otherwise, I still enjoy Duxford, even walking around this beautiful historic site fills me with awe, seeing the original buildings about on both the technical and 'domestic' sites.
ShutterPlane

Re: May Airshow

Postby 106500 on Mon 29 May 2017, 3:00 pm

Wing Walkers are fine for joe public but in my opinion they overdo the smoke every time; 2/3 of the display yesterday was partially obscured by the pall of smoke they laid over the airfield! Its the same wherever they go.....
106500

Re: May Airshow

Postby Mr Potton on Mon 29 May 2017, 3:29 pm

I was there on Saturday and as a non-expert had a pretty good time of it, despite the proximity of two amiable Italian photographers who, having elbowed their way to the fence, chose to stand on either side of me and spend the entire day shouting across me in their native language, the dialogue only being interrupted at each pass of an aircraft, when they had their eyes to the viewfinder and then to camera LCD screens immediately afterwards. I don't think either of them actually watched the show at all!

I notice that there were fewer food stands than on previous occasions (and three adjacent ones all offered bacon rolls at £5 - so much for competition!). And no Spitfire bar either? Perhaps that's why there was no gents urinals behind the food stands as there has been on previous occasions. I bought a programme, mainly as a souvenir of the day, but didn't get the usual slip of paper with the schedule on it inside.

I'm not as fussy as some on this messageboard and I enjoyed most of the acts, and yes, I thought the Rafale stole the Typhoon's thunder. But the Sea Vixen won hands down for sheer grace, I thought. Interesting to note that the Typhoon is capable of flying at twice the speed of the Rafale though. But as with last May, many of the acts seemed to be a long way away, either horizontally or vertically. Given the wind, I thought Duxford did well to get most of the acts up in the air, I think the only thing which didn't show was the Sopwith Pup and the parachutists. I just received an email from Duxford asking for my opinion of the weekend and have responded.....

Mr P
Mr Potton

Re: May Airshow

Postby paullangford on Mon 29 May 2017, 3:55 pm

...........anyone else see the pair of F-15's in the distance coming and going ?
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Re: May Airshow

Postby County1884 on Mon 29 May 2017, 4:30 pm

Yeah I saw them out past the M11 when the JP and Strikemaster were displaying
Could have done a quick low pass.....
County1884

Re: May Airshow

Postby County1884 on Mon 29 May 2017, 4:33 pm

Yeah I saw them out past the M11 when the JP and Strikemaster were displaying
Could have done a quick low pass.....
County1884

Re: May Airshow

Postby mafro987daboss on Mon 29 May 2017, 4:59 pm

Mr Potton wrote:Interesting to note that the Typhoon is capable of flying at twice the speed of the Rafale though.
Mr P


No it can't.
mafro987daboss

Re: May Airshow

Postby adethorne on Mon 29 May 2017, 7:55 pm

mafro987daboss wrote:
Mr Potton wrote:Interesting to note that the Typhoon is capable of flying at twice the speed of the Rafale though.
Mr P


No it can't.


No it can't, but the RAF does limit what it does in an airshow, whereas the french are a little bit more generous in its airshow flight envelopes.
adethorne

Re: May Airshow

Postby spellow3010 on Wed 31 May 2017, 2:27 pm

My first Duxford visit since the September 2015 show. It was nice to be there on Saturday early doors in the sunshine and calm - coating myself in sunscreen. The brief shower didn't disrupt too much, but left behind blue skies and a surprising wind, which would later impact on the display schedule. Hey-ho.

The place never really felt full to be fair in comparison with previous experiences. I chose not to spend money on the flightline walk (and got told to 'get over myself' on Facebook for commenting). From the 'tank bank end' (ish), I looked to the row of aircraft and couldn't see any that weren't parked 'tail on' to the walk. There were some airframes, like the Mig-15 that were parked on the jet pan for obvious reasons, but I didn't fancy photographing the rear end of the rest. My choice. No regrets, just saying.

This was the first experience for me of the revised CAA arrangements. Wow... it left me feeling a little downbeat. It was a good variety of aircraft and acts. But as a venue, a Canon 100-400 (grey) just won't cut it now for aircraft in the air. The Blades felt high and distant, the Mustang, the Apache, the air racers, the Typhoon etc. The Apache was very awkward to photograph (always is on a blue sky) and get the pyros in. For me, the worst of it was the delightful pair of Mk 1 Spitfires - nice take off shot, but the rest of that display, as nicely formed and paired was too distant for me to bother with.

Enjoyed the Sea Vixen... The Rafale was the icing. Safe to say the Typhoon won't be winning any awards at RIAT this year.

Summary - If I go back, I'll take binoculars. It kind of left me feeling as though Duxford has kind of lost it as a venue now. If you're a togger (inside) or if you have a pair of binocs. Maybe it's all a ruse to shift Planes TV DVDs??? :grin:

On the pricing debate - yeah, the car park fee rankles. Free kids is great, if the kids are there and interested in the show. Too many 'little miss or master moody' who just stretch out on the grass and moan 'can we go home yet?'

Taking my daughter (for free) to Cosford. She's been a few times with me before to Duxford events. She knows what she likes and tunes out of the rest. Fortunately, she's not little miss moody. :smile:
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spellow3010

Re: May Airshow

Postby Dan O'Hagan on Wed 31 May 2017, 3:47 pm

You forget who sponsors RIAT, the Typhoon ALWAYS gets an award... :whistle:
Dan O'Hagan

Re: May Airshow

Postby Ryan. on Wed 31 May 2017, 6:09 pm

spellow3010 wrote: This was the first experience for me of the revised CAA arrangements. Wow... it left me feeling a little downbeat. It was a good variety of aircraft and acts. But as a venue, a Canon 100-400 (grey) just won't cut it now for aircraft in the air.


Out of interest what end did you stand at?
Ryan.

Re: May Airshow

Postby Stagger2 on Wed 31 May 2017, 9:38 pm

paullangford wrote:...........anyone else see the pair of F-15's in the distance coming and going ?

Saw them & remembered seeing a Notam for a 'Brookwood Cemetery' flypast (or similar?) Agreed, it was a wasted opportunity by Duxford not to negotiate a flypast outbound to Brookwood or inbound to LN, especially given that they knew fully well the Vixen would be a no-show?
I'll also wager they were closer to Duxford during transit than they ever got to Brookwood!! :lol:
Stagger2

Re: May Airshow

Postby spellow3010 on Thu 01 Jun 2017, 10:46 am

Ryan. wrote:
spellow3010 wrote: This was the first experience for me of the revised CAA arrangements. Wow... it left me feeling a little downbeat. It was a good variety of aircraft and acts. But as a venue, a Canon 100-400 (grey) just won't cut it now for aircraft in the air.


Out of interest what end did you stand at?


Hi Ryan,
a good question as I looked along the crowd line to the other end and wondered what the experience was like for others. Myself, I was about 50 feet 'left' of what used to be the Tank Bank, so the western end. It seemed that those placed 'crowd centre' would fare even worse than I thought I was... and I guess those at the M11 end would have been about the same as me. For me, the B-17 topside approach look to show promise, but seemed to carry on southward as though it were going to end up at Stansted instead! :biggrin:

A bit of hyperbole maybe, but when I go to Legends, I will take binoculars and try out the 1.4 extender on the 100-400. Failing that, I'll sell the lens and go back to my Sigma 150-500. The reason I saved for the Canon 'grey' was that I experience tail off of sharpness between 400 and 500mm with the Sigma. Of course, it could all be my lack of technique... but the fact is, with a 400mm lens, the crops are super tight, leaving me with a finished jpg of barely a megabyte. That, for me, is the beginning of the end in terms of even trying to shoot stuff in the air at that venue.
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Re: May Airshow

Postby spellow3010 on Thu 01 Jun 2017, 10:48 am

Dan O'Hagan wrote:You forget who sponsors RIAT, the Typhoon ALWAYS gets an award... :whistle:


Good point! :lol:

The Rafale should win one over the Typhoon for the livery alone. The plainest of plain planes that Typhoon was :ninja:
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spellow3010

Re: May Airshow

Postby Ryan. on Thu 01 Jun 2017, 9:54 pm

spellow3010 wrote:
Ryan. wrote:
spellow3010 wrote: This was the first experience for me of the revised CAA arrangements. Wow... it left me feeling a little downbeat. It was a good variety of aircraft and acts. But as a venue, a Canon 100-400 (grey) just won't cut it now for aircraft in the air.


Out of interest what end did you stand at?


Hi Ryan,
a good question as I looked along the crowd line to the other end and wondered what the experience was like for others. Myself, I was about 50 feet 'left' of what used to be the Tank Bank, so the western end. It seemed that those placed 'crowd centre' would fare even worse than I thought I was... and I guess those at the M11 end would have been about the same as me. For me, the B-17 topside approach look to show promise, but seemed to carry on southward as though it were going to end up at Stansted instead! :biggrin:


Duxford has been hit hard by the new CAA regulations. Things have improved, last years Spring Airshow being almost unwatchable as aircraft avoided the M11 end of the airfield almost entirely, now they do use the area behind the Airspace hangar to reposition and therefore you do get a topside or two. However it's never going to go back to how it was. Flying Legends last year moved the crowd line forward, people stood on jetpan where the Jet Provest, Strikemaster and Mig 15 were parked. This straighted the crowd line quite a lot and allowed aircraft to fly as close as they could given the new CAA directions, (a big improvement in my opinion) however the new fencing is back, pretty much, to the old crowd line. I do hope the IWM consider moving it again.
Ryan.

Re: May Airshow

Postby yak-aviation on Mon 12 Jun 2017, 9:53 pm

I took my not quite 3yr old boy who has shown a tremendous interest in aircraft. It was his first time to Duxford, although not his first time to an aviation museum. This was his first proper airshow though and despite of the additional safety rules, in my view, the air show was still a blast. The Typhoon is always fantastic to see and hear, the Wingwalkers were great to watch, albeit a bit too distant, the Apache routine was enjoyable, especially with the explosions.

That said, neither of us could be 100% focused on the show to the point one could critique, but it was all much appreciated. I'm sure it's easy to pick holes in air displays and focus on this instead of what it is. Would I go back to Duxford just for the airshow? Probably not, not unless I'm taking kids, but have always enjoyed visiting Duxford anyway, especially by air.

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