RIAT 2018 wishlist

Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby F-5F on Thu 12 Apr 2018, 12:24 pm

verreli wrote:
I think RIAT isn't necessarily the place to be seen, but the place to 'meet'. This will likely continue, especially if the organisers make this a feature of the show, albeit one not available to the general public. The evolution (decline) of the Farnborough trade show has almost certainly had an effect on RIAT. This is likely to continue. The one curve ball is what influence the American presence at Fairford will have in the future.


Based on today's update I think you are correct Verreli. 50 airships compared to 37 at this point last year!! From my personal point of view I couldn't care less about this statistic and don't consider this an update (are RIAT struggling to find things to tell us?) unless each of them bring some of their pilots/aircraft.
F-5F

Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby AngryAndyPandy on Thu 12 Apr 2018, 5:47 pm

F-5F wrote:are RIAT struggling to find things to tell us?


No.
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Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby CJS on Thu 12 Apr 2018, 6:35 pm

F-5F wrote:
verreli wrote:
I think RIAT isn't necessarily the place to be seen, but the place to 'meet'. This will likely continue, especially if the organisers make this a feature of the show, albeit one not available to the general public. The evolution (decline) of the Farnborough trade show has almost certainly had an effect on RIAT. This is likely to continue. The one curve ball is what influence the American presence at Fairford will have in the future.


Based on today's update I think you are correct Verreli. 50 airships compared to 37 at this point last year!! From my personal point of view I couldn't care less about this statistic and don't consider this an update (are RIAT struggling to find things to tell us?) unless each of them bring some of their pilots/aircraft.


In case you'd missed it, today they also confirmed participation from 4 air arms, including one from the other side of the world and one bringing 50% of it's C-27js for the static display.

Last week we had confirmed another popular fast jet display and 2 rarely seen classic jets for the static park.

So no, it doesn't seem like they're struggling to me. But hey, keep bashing them, I'm sure it at least helps with team morale. :surrender: :up:
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Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby F-5F on Thu 12 Apr 2018, 10:58 pm

CJS wrote:
F-5F wrote:
verreli wrote:
I think RIAT isn't necessarily the place to be seen, but the place to 'meet'. This will likely continue, especially if the organisers make this a feature of the show, albeit one not available to the general public. The evolution (decline) of the Farnborough trade show has almost certainly had an effect on RIAT. This is likely to continue. The one curve ball is what influence the American presence at Fairford will have in the future.


Based on today's update I think you are correct Verreli. 50 airships compared to 37 at this point last year!! From my personal point of view I couldn't care less about this statistic and don't consider this an update (are RIAT struggling to find things to tell us?) unless each of them bring some of their pilots/aircraft.


In case you'd missed it, today they also confirmed participation from 4 air arms, including one from the other side of the world and one bringing 50% of it's C-27js for the static display.

Last week we had confirmed another popular fast jet display and 2 rarely seen classic jets for the static park.

So no, it doesn't seem like they're struggling to me. But hey, keep bashing them, I'm sure it at least helps with team morale. :surrender: :up:


Didn't miss it. Don't be so patronising. Or are you another part-timer at DBH?

Are we not allowed to question participants (or lack of). Where did you think I got the information about the airships. This was my main point. Who cares about airships? Was great to see the Wedgetail last year but can't get excited about it this year sorry CJS. As for Solo Turk - always impressive but seen it before. And 50% of 2nr is 1nr!! :lmao:

All DBH can do is invite countries to participate - understood. It seems as though there may be some reluctance to participate which needs understanding. Compared to the Radom update it is disappointing. There is time and undoubtedly things will improve and hopefully we will get a Radom style update in a few weeks - I sincerely hope so.

Apologies for voicing my opinion and daring to question DBH. After all a week's attendance with a hotel thrown in doesn't cost much. I thought this was a forum for discussion. Maybe I shouldn't get involved. :pinkwafer:
F-5F

Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby Gonzo230 on Fri 13 Apr 2018, 12:08 am

Do you not think that having a high number of ‘airships’ is a good thing?

That if a Chief of Air Staff attends RIAT and the hospitality along with their partner, and has a great experience, they’d be more likely to want to return, and perhaps more likely to authorise aircraft attendance in the following years?
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Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby Brevet Cable on Fri 13 Apr 2018, 12:20 am

That's a mantra which is often chanted, but is there any real evidence that that happens?
I think it's only been reported as happening once in recent years, hasn't it?
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Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby Gonzo230 on Fri 13 Apr 2018, 1:15 am

Brevet Cable wrote:That's a mantra which is often chanted, but is there any real evidence that that happens?
I think it's only been reported as happening once in recent years, hasn't it?


All those years and all those relationships and it’s only made a difference once? Really?

At this level a lot of it is about developing relationships, building networks, cultivating the Air Attaches, and as such is relatively nebulous. Not sure how that could happen if the hospitality programme for foreign CASs wasn’t there.

I imagine DBH reckon it works, given they effort they put in to it.

I certainly don’t think it detracts from the airshow itself, does it?

It’s like the amazing level of organisation that goes on behind the scenes for the visiting flight and ground crews. Everything is laid on for them, so that a side effect of their attendance is that they return back to their unit wanting to come back the following year.

We’ve seen it in social media posts where people have claimed ‘so and so is coming back next year because I talked to the pilot and he said he’d love to’ etc etc. This can only be a good thing.

Get the crews wanting to come back, get the Chiefs wanting to come back, and that’s a little of the battle won.
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Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby Brevet Cable on Fri 13 Apr 2018, 2:21 am

You may want to re-read my post......if you do, you'll see that I'm asking a question not making an empirical statement.
I don't do 'social media', so have no idea what's been claimed on there.
As stated, I can only recall one instance in recent years where it was reported that an air arm has attended with aircraft the year after their 'Airship' has attended.
Have there been more? I don't know -- hence the question.
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Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby CJS on Fri 13 Apr 2018, 5:29 am

F-5F wrote:
CJS wrote:
F-5F wrote:
verreli wrote:
I think RIAT isn't necessarily the place to be seen, but the place to 'meet'. This will likely continue, especially if the organisers make this a feature of the show, albeit one not available to the general public. The evolution (decline) of the Farnborough trade show has almost certainly had an effect on RIAT. This is likely to continue. The one curve ball is what influence the American presence at Fairford will have in the future.


Based on today's update I think you are correct Verreli. 50 airships compared to 37 at this point last year!! From my personal point of view I couldn't care less about this statistic and don't consider this an update (are RIAT struggling to find things to tell us?) unless each of them bring some of their pilots/aircraft.


In case you'd missed it, today they also confirmed participation from 4 air arms, including one from the other side of the world and one bringing 50% of it's C-27js for the static display.

Last week we had confirmed another popular fast jet display and 2 rarely seen classic jets for the static park.

So no, it doesn't seem like they're struggling to me. But hey, keep bashing them, I'm sure it at least helps with team morale. :surrender: :up:


Didn't miss it. Don't be so patronising. Or are you another part-timer at DBH?

Are we not allowed to question participants (or lack of). Where did you think I got the information about the airships. This was my main point. Who cares about airships? Was great to see the Wedgetail last year but can't get excited about it this year sorry CJS. As for Solo Turk - always impressive but seen it before. And 50% of 2nr is 1nr!! :lmao:

All DBH can do is invite countries to participate - understood. It seems as though there may be some reluctance to participate which needs understanding. Compared to the Radom update it is disappointing. There is time and undoubtedly things will improve and hopefully we will get a Radom style update in a few weeks - I sincerely hope so.

Apologies for voicing my opinion and daring to question DBH. After all a week's attendance with a hotel thrown in doesn't cost much. I thought this was a forum for discussion. Maybe I shouldn't get involved. :pinkwafer:


I suggest you try reading your post again - you asked if dbh had anything to tell us, when what you really meant (I suspect) is that they didn't have anything to tell us that you wanted to hear - hardly the same thing.

I wasn't being patronising, merely addressing your question.
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Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby Berf on Fri 13 Apr 2018, 6:38 am

Brevet Cable wrote:You may want to re-read my post......if you do, you'll see that I'm asking a question not making an empirical statement.
I don't do 'social media', so have no idea what's been claimed on there.
As stated, I can only recall one instance in recent years where it was reported that an air arm has attended with aircraft the year after their 'Airship' has attended.
Have there been more? I don't know -- hence the question.



The ability to interact with other 'air chiefs' and discuss issues with crews and their opportunity to do the same with other crews sometimes in an informal way as well as semi official way was an important part of the decision to send Swedish Gripen aircraft to the show - according to the Swedish air attache with whom I spoke three or four years ago. I doubt if it is different for many other air arms.
Berf

Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby verreli on Fri 13 Apr 2018, 7:40 am

Berf wrote:The ability to interact with other 'air chiefs' and discuss issues with crews and their opportunity to do the same with other crews sometimes in an informal way as well as semi official way was an important part of the decision to send Swedish Gripen aircraft to the show - according to the Swedish air attache with whom I spoke three or four years ago. I doubt if it is different for many other air arms.


Agree. RIAT for the enthusiast will have much more longevity and variety if this continues and expands. The UK is an 'effort' to get to for many of the nations that attend so there must be some payback for the airarm itself. Think of it like a global tigermeet with a dedicated airshow. I can say that the CAS's that attend do take pride in having their aircraft display at the show and this helps with attendance. Why do you think some nations come back year after year?

As for the Farnborough link, when you have a concentrated grouping of potential customers at an event, it doesn't hurt to give your product extra exposure. Sure, an airarm isn't going to go shopping for a new F-18 just because they saw it fly at RIAT but marketing is far more complex than that. I'm actually surprised LM, Boeing et al haven't sent products on off Farnborough years given the exposure it would give and relatively low cost (vs their marketing budget).
verreli

Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby Gonzo230 on Sat 14 Apr 2018, 12:56 am

Apologies Brevet, I was reading too much into your question.

But why/how would anyone not involved know how useful the Chiefs of Air Staff programme is?

It appeared to me as if it was being dismissed by some posters, without any thought to its use.

In terms of social media, I would categorise Internet fora as a part of social media, and indeed I’m sure I’ve seen such remarks here before. To be honest I don’t go to any other enthusiast forums, nor follow many on Twitter, so come to think of it I’ve only ever seen it here.
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Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby Airshowhammer on Wed 18 Apr 2018, 3:19 pm

Now the ingredients are being added to the cake, I can't help but fantasise about how awesome it would be to see the Buff & Bone return to flying like in the 00's where one would display after another. One can dream ay? :love:
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Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby davidjones533 on Thu 19 Apr 2018, 9:07 pm

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Last edited by davidjones533 on Wed 12 Sep 2018, 8:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby Airshowhammer on Fri 20 Apr 2018, 7:37 pm

I remember last year a european airshow was due to have a flying Ukrainian SU-24 might have been CIAF? But i don’t recall it coming to fruition. Correct me if i’m wrong. That would be seriously special. (I know state the obvious)
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Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby rdchawk on Thu 26 Apr 2018, 7:46 am

Was thinking would be great if RAF could do a 4 ship heritage flight so to speak of Spitfire Hurricane Typhoon and Tornado
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Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby MiG_Eater on Thu 26 Apr 2018, 7:57 am

Every year when i'm hoping against hope for almost impossible additions to the participation, 'Su-24' comes to mind...
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Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby 138EAW on Thu 26 Apr 2018, 8:15 am

Looks like the Belgians have a NH90 SAR demo, would be nice too see after last year's Sea King
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Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby Wes_Howes on Mon 30 Apr 2018, 11:44 am

Would be great to see the CH-53K, I'd say it's likely to be at FIA.
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Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby duffspeed on Mon 30 Apr 2018, 3:28 pm

How about an Mi-26? Has anybody seen one fly, even at MAKS?
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Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby Airshowhammer on Mon 30 Apr 2018, 3:50 pm

Wes_Howes wrote:Would be great to see the CH-53K, I'd say it's likely to be at FIA.


Seconded. Beast for the static park!
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Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby Skyflash on Mon 30 Apr 2018, 3:55 pm

duffspeed wrote:How about an Mi-26? Has anybody seen one fly, even at MAKS?


There was one last year, took part in the daily helicopter flypast which opened the show at MAKS. It's an almighty beast of a thing:

Image
by Gordon Duncan, on Flickr

Image
by Gordon Duncan, on Flickr

Odds of seeing one in the UK: sadly negligible I feel, unless the manufacturer popped up with a type-demonstrator for Farnborough.
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Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby Wrexham Mackem on Mon 30 Apr 2018, 4:00 pm

duffspeed wrote:How about an Mi-26? Has anybody seen one fly, even at MAKS?


It flew at Farnborough in 84, in Aeroflot colours. It appeared again at Farnborough, but I don't think it appeared in the flying display again after 84. That is to say, I didn't see it fly again after 84. As Gordon says, an absolute beast. Huge.
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Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby Airshowhammer on Wed 02 May 2018, 8:47 am

Can't help thinking after the recent additions of the Rafale, Couteau Delta & the Romanian Mig the Wingwalkers will be the icing on the cake. :wat:
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Re: RIAT 2018 wishlist

Postby Rossbeef on Wed 02 May 2018, 8:49 am

For me, just a Ukrainian Flanker display and it would not bother me if anything else did not turn up!

Fantastic looking show and congratulations to DBH for their efforts.
Rossbeef

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