RIAT 2019

Re: RIAT 2019

Postby rockfordstone on Wed 14 Nov 2018, 11:07 am

vulcanshammer wrote:
Brevet Cable wrote:Or that there are a lot of gullible fools around....


Why does planning ahead for a nice day out, taking advantage of the best price make anyone gullible? Or indeed a fool?


exactly my feeling.

i don't understand why buying early bird tickets makes you "gullible" but it's perfectly acceptable to scramble for FRIAT tickets where the first payment is expected before any planes are announced.

i think the fact the tickets have sold is an indication of how strong RIAT is in it's own right.
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Re: RIAT 2019

Postby Tommy on Wed 14 Nov 2018, 12:41 pm

Fear of missing out drives it, I think.

It's equally gullible to book FRIAT so early, too.

Back in 2015, my first FRIAT, I think I booked in, when, May?

Maybe it was January or something for 2016 (cos sellout warning) and last year, well...

Or maybe SEB tickets are limited this year so it artificially feels crammed when in actual fact its not. And because of all the sell-out warnings, people who were waiting jump in because they fear they will miss out.

Or maybe I'm just a cynical, bitter, grumpy, ill-informed old trouser-cough with few better things to write about whilst eating a crappy meal deal.
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Re: RIAT 2019

Postby Brevet Cable on Wed 14 Nov 2018, 12:45 pm

As per my previous post.....it's not buying SEB tickets, it's the ridiculous rush to buy them about 4-5 months or more before the first attendance announcements are likely to be made.
It's not like the old system where they're only available up until a certain date, so there's no good reason for most people to rush out & buy them - if very few people did so, they'd still be available when the first confirmed attendances have been announced.
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Brevet Cable

Re: RIAT 2019

Postby capercaillie on Wed 14 Nov 2018, 1:20 pm

The issue I think is that there is now sod all else on for the enthusiast to see or visit without staring into the sun all day and getting pooed on from a great height.

Fairford is a reasonably easy base to work in terms of lighting, you can do the arrivals reasonably at leisure, even the option of great departures with FRIAT, it also still attracts a pretty good variety of military aircraft from around the world, so although not at 1990s levels of "Wow, what a show", its still the best there is by a long chalk.

Alternatives left for military action in the UK are a small museum base with a runway not long enough to see fast jets and heavies operating from there with awkward lighting most of the day and a Navy organised show which had a boom in 2018, but can be hit or miss, where they knackered the arrivals day years ago and on air days you're looking into the sun for the whole display.

Therefore people are prepared to pay up early and take the chance on the one show remaining where you might actually enjoy a display without burning out your retinas or suffering a chronic headache.

Even at its poorest it was still the best show by far, you know some good stuff will be there, therefore people pay up early.
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Re: RIAT 2019

Postby vulcanshammer on Wed 14 Nov 2018, 2:19 pm

Buying tickets for an event that you are sure you are going to attend is not gullible. DBH are making no promises other than that there will be an airshow. Whether they have changed the number of SEB tickets this year, we don't know; however they have sold out for Saturday so anybody rushing to buy them due to the ticket warnings was not gullible either. It is slightly odd how the early demand has seemingly increased in the last few years, but at the end of the day if you are looking at attending an airshow next year, RIAT is a very sensible option and due to the format for SEB and EB tickets changing it makes perfect sense to get in early. It seems that those who are complaining should simply be annoyed that there has been a change in the SEB/EB allocation, and that the best price might not available at the moment they want to make their decision. However DBH are being very transparent with their pricing structure (we'll leave Friday out of this). By all means wait until the exact airframe you want to see is on the confirmed list, but it's likely the tickets will be more expensive. FIN
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Re: RIAT 2019

Postby jasonT1981 on Wed 14 Nov 2018, 2:25 pm

Just upgraded my Sunday ticket to Pimms. Have been debating it for a week or so, so went ahead and did it.
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Re: RIAT 2019

Postby Gonzo230 on Wed 14 Nov 2018, 8:53 pm

To be fair I’d imagine that RAT would sell just as many tickets if it didn’t offer any advance discounts at all.

At least this way the dedicated enthusiasts who know they’ll be going can get discounted tickets.

If you prefer to wait for aircraft attendance announcements, or the medium-range weather forecast, you can do that too.
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Re: RIAT 2019

Postby Brevet Cable on Tue 20 Nov 2018, 3:45 pm

vulcanshammer wrote:Buying tickets for an event that you are sure you are going to attend is not gullible. DBH are making no promises other than that there will be an airshow. Whether they have changed the number of SEB tickets this year, we don't know; however they have sold out for Saturday so anybody rushing to buy them due to the ticket warnings was not gullible either.

But they were, in my opinion, because if they'd all been sensible they could have waited until the first announcements before buying the SEB tickets.
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Re: RIAT 2019

Postby Gonzo230 on Wed 21 Nov 2018, 4:16 am

Brevet Cable wrote:
vulcanshammer wrote:Buying tickets for an event that you are sure you are going to attend is not gullible. DBH are making no promises other than that there will be an airshow. Whether they have changed the number of SEB tickets this year, we don't know; however they have sold out for Saturday so anybody rushing to buy them due to the ticket warnings was not gullible either.

But they were, in my opinion, because if they'd all been sensible they could have waited until the first announcements before buying the SEB tickets.


That's spurious logic though, isn't it. Your scenario would only happen if every potential SEB-buyer acted as one. If you know you're going to attend, what's the point in waiting until the first announcements?


gul·li·ble
/ˈɡələb(ə)l/Submit
adjective
easily persuaded to believe something; credulous.


Don't think it fits this situation.
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Re: RIAT 2019

Postby spellow3010 on Wed 21 Nov 2018, 8:49 am

Impulsive... habitual... and easily pleased.

That's me :tongue:
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Re: RIAT 2019

Postby Brevet Cable on Wed 21 Nov 2018, 9:13 am

Gonzo230 wrote:That's spurious logic though, isn't it. Your scenario would only happen if every potential SEB-buyer acted as one. If you know you're going to attend, what's the point in waiting until the first announcements?

Doesn't have to be all of them, though.
How many times have you read posters on various forums / social media sites bemoaning the fact that they'd bought tickets & then realised the show wasn't going to live up to their expectations?
How often do you see people selling their tickets ( and I don't mean the touts & scam-artists on Fleabay )?
Yes, there are some who will go to every single show-day regardless of how crap it may be, but I'd say they're in a distinct minority.

gul·li·ble
easily persuaded to believe something; credulous.


Don't think it fits this situation.

"X% of SEB tickets sold!"......oh, must rush out and get mine before they sell out.
No thought going towards wondering "yes, but how many tickets does X% represent?"
It's no different to those who rush out and buy something just because there's a big sign saying 'SALE!!'
Ergo, gullible.
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Brevet Cable

Re: RIAT 2019

Postby Gonzo230 on Thu 22 Nov 2018, 1:43 am

What is it you think these SEB-buyers are being fooled into believing?

Gullible is being asked to go and buy some left handed screwdrivers, or some striped paint. i.e. being fooled.

Gullible is not deciding to purchase a certain ticket for a certain price. The only other factor in play is the limited numbers of tickets at that price, and that's no lie or attempted fooling.

It's no different to those who rush out and buy something just because there's a big sign saying 'SALE!!'


Yes, I think it is different. Gullible is rushing out to buy something that's not needed or wanted 'just because there's a big sign'........

It's not a complex system. Buy now at this price, knowing there have been no announcements, or wait until later and pay more once some aircraft have been announced. If you don't think it's a good buy, and would rather wait, that's fine.

Anyway, I'll leave it there, as I'm sure we're not going to agree.
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Re: RIAT 2019

Postby rockfordstone on Thu 22 Nov 2018, 8:26 am

i paid for a weekend with fast jets. one thing that is more or less guaranteed is a weekend with fast jets.
ill take being gullible. i know what i'm getting, i'll be happy with the details and i've saved probably a minimum of £100 on tickets and accommodation by booking now.
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Re: RIAT 2019

Postby harkins on Thu 22 Nov 2018, 11:13 am

I'm with rockfordstone. I bought my ticket at the first opportunity as even a poor RIAT is the only place you're going to see at least half a dozen modern military jets perform flying displays without the need for a passport. It's a no brainer in that respect.

The only downside I can see to committing early is that we obviously can't foresee any issue that might stop us going when the time comes. But that could still effect you a day before the show and it's not impossible to sell on a ticket for it these days is it?
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Re: RIAT 2019

Postby jasonT1981 on Tue 27 Nov 2018, 5:20 pm

No Couteau Delta in 2019

It is with great regret that I announce the 2019 suspension of the Delta Knife Indeed, the commitment of the Air Force since 2014 with Operation Chammal and Barkhane has created an "organic debt" that we does not succeed in resorbing. Following below

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Re: RIAT 2019

Postby Go4Long on Tue 27 Nov 2018, 7:55 pm

That's too bad...they've been a yearly favourite for me :(
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Re: RIAT 2019

Postby Brevet Cable on Tue 27 Nov 2018, 8:56 pm

What...all of 2 years? :wink: :biggrin:
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Re: RIAT 2019

Postby Go4Long on Tue 27 Nov 2018, 9:51 pm

Brevet Cable wrote:What...all of 2 years? :wink: :biggrin:


Sure, if you count them as a different team than ramex delta which was remarkably similar save for the name.

Regardless of that, they were a yearly favourite to me ever year they came, being 2 years. As I have only been to Air Tattoo the last 3 years, 66.6% of my Air Tattoos have seen them in my top 3 performances.
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Re: RIAT 2019

Postby MiG_Eater on Tue 27 Nov 2018, 11:30 pm

A real shame. A proper 'old fashioned' airshow act.
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Re: RIAT 2019

Postby boff180 on Wed 28 Nov 2018, 7:41 am

On the plus side,

One of the CD pilots kindly posted on our Facebook page last night that he would like to bring a M2000D over for static this year.

I’ll class that as an unconfirmed provisional first participant :wink:
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Re: RIAT 2019

Postby harkins on Wed 28 Nov 2018, 9:30 am

Disappointing news, especially as it's not like anyone else will step up and fill the gap with a front line two-ship display. It's certainly going to be a very tough year for DBH.
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harkins

Re: RIAT 2019

Postby Airshowhammer on Wed 28 Nov 2018, 10:38 am

harkins wrote:Disappointing news, especially as it's not like anyone else will step up and fill the gap with a front line two-ship display. It's certainly going to be a very tough year for DBH.


The new Russian test pilots SU-35 pair don't ya know?
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Re: RIAT 2019

Postby capercaillie on Wed 28 Nov 2018, 10:54 am

harkins wrote:Disappointing news, especially as it's not like anyone else will step up and fill the gap with a front line two-ship display. It's certainly going to be a very tough year for DBH.


Certainly not with the gut grinding, thunderous noise, good looks and panache of the Mirage 2000s, the Polish Fitter pair would be a pleasant return though.

Huge loss, both 2000 pairs have been a star turn over the last four RIATs as were the solo B/C displays of yore. Perhaps the UAE solo could be tempted across to plug the hole? :dunno: :whistle:
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Re: RIAT 2019

Postby harkins on Wed 28 Nov 2018, 1:40 pm

Blimey, I can't recall the last time I saw a Mirage 2000 fly a solo display. Must be pushing twenty years for me.

A middle eastern air force 2000 would be amazing, but hand on heart, given general participation of all air arms from that region I would be absolutely gobsmacked to see anything other than a C-130 for static display at best.

On the subject of ex Soviet types; does anyone know if they ever got over the ejection seat issues etc that pretty much wiped out all but the Ukrainian Su-27s from display flying last season? (and even many static appearances too). I was under the impression that the Romanians were expediting there acquisition of second hand F-16s and that a Mig-21 solo display would be highly unlikely to happen ever again.

And I wonder what the odds are on the RAF working up an F-35 solo display for next summer. My gut feeling is that they'll be too few and too busy for that to happen. Maybe a flypast with the Red Arrows will be the most we'll get.
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Re: RIAT 2019

Postby Chris G on Wed 28 Nov 2018, 2:41 pm

Given the Reds will be away after RIAT I think some form of limited F-35 demo is a pretty good possibility otherwise it'll be bad PR for the UK shows they miss.
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