Mystery plane

Mystery plane

Postby Col. Chibani on Sat 27 Jan 2018, 8:13 pm

These 2 photos were taken in France in 1940.
Despite extensive research, the fighter/trainer-like plane remains unidentified.

Image

Image

It may be a british aircraft purchased before the defeat.
It looks like a Percival Proctor but the canopy doesn't match.
If anybody here can help ...
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Col. Chibani

Re: Mystery plane

Postby Berf on Sat 27 Jan 2018, 8:41 pm

Front part looks like a Miles variant - love the one in the background...
Berf

Re: Mystery plane

Postby FarnboroJohn on Sat 27 Jan 2018, 9:27 pm

Berf wrote:love the one in the background...


Agreed: "the fools - they've built my blotting-paper doodles again!"

John
FarnboroJohn

Re: Mystery plane

Postby boff180 on Sun 28 Jan 2018, 7:05 am

Nardi FN.305A

41 delivered to the French by 1940.
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boff180
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Re: Mystery plane

Postby Berf on Sun 28 Jan 2018, 8:35 am

Good one Boff!
Berf

Re: Mystery plane

Postby Daz on Sun 28 Jan 2018, 9:49 am

The one at the very back with bent wings is a Loire-Nieuport LN-411.
I trust no one, not even myself! Josef Stalin
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Daz

Re: Mystery plane

Postby jalfrezi on Sun 28 Jan 2018, 10:58 am

I looked at the Nardi last night, but there are some substantial differences - wheel spats, rounded canopy and fuselage, wingtips, and the tail. Even the way the canopy opens is different.

I'm wondering if it was a prototype, or maybe a civil type pressed into service?
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jalfrezi
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Re: Mystery plane

Postby Col. Chibani on Sun 28 Jan 2018, 11:50 am

jalfrezi wrote:I looked at the Nardi last night, but there are some substantial differences - wheel spats, rounded canopy and fuselage, wingtips, and the tail. Even the way the canopy opens is different.

I'm wondering if it was a prototype, or maybe a civil type pressed into service?


The Nardi was indeed considered, but had been discarded for the above reasons.
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Col. Chibani

Re: Mystery plane

Postby Mikoyan_Foxhound_31_ on Sun 28 Jan 2018, 8:48 pm

Looks quite a lot like a Cuadron C.430 Rafale w/ modified wing tips and tail. I believe Hélène Boucher had one with that same intake on the engine. I couldn't find any Renault 4P modifications listing an intake/ radiator or whatever it is on records. Looks custom.
-Foxhound
Mikoyan_Foxhound_31_

Re: Mystery plane

Postby jalfrezi on Sun 28 Jan 2018, 9:49 pm

This Caudron C.600 has an identical nose, perhaps it was a Caudron prototype?

Image
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jalfrezi
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Re: Mystery plane

Postby Wissam24 on Sun 28 Jan 2018, 10:48 pm

The absolute lack of any markings on the fuselage is probably significant
Twitter: @samwise24 | Flickr: samwise24 | Shamelessly copying LN Strike Eagle's avatar ideas since 2016
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Re: Mystery plane

Postby Col. Chibani on Mon 29 Jan 2018, 9:54 am

Thank you for your tracks !

2 more shots of the aircraft :

Image
Image
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Col. Chibani

Re: Mystery plane

Postby Theflyingschoolgirl on Mon 29 Jan 2018, 8:27 pm

I have in interest in WW2 liaison aircraft. I fly a beautiful old L4, an L3 too. I think this could possibly be a mailett 201? I haven't compared pictures or anything like that, but have seen pictures of the Mailett and think it maybe similar. Maybe an avenue worth exploring.
Theflyingschoolgirl

Re: Mystery plane

Postby jalfrezi on Mon 29 Jan 2018, 9:07 pm

Theflyingschoolgirl wrote:I have in interest in WW2 liaison aircraft. I fly a beautiful old L4, an L3 too. I think this could possibly be a mailett 201? I haven't compared pictures or anything like that, but have seen pictures of the Mailett and think it maybe similar. Maybe an avenue worth exploring.


I think you might be onto something, I found a pic of the Maillet and the canopy is a good match for the other pics.

Image
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jalfrezi
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Re: Mystery plane

Postby Theflyingschoolgirl on Mon 29 Jan 2018, 9:09 pm

jalfrezi wrote:
Theflyingschoolgirl wrote:I have in interest in WW2 liaison aircraft. I fly a beautiful old L4, an L3 too. I think this could possibly be a mailett 201? I haven't compared pictures or anything like that, but have seen pictures of the Mailett and think it maybe similar. Maybe an avenue worth exploring.


I think you might be onto something, I found a pic of the Maillet and the canopy is a good match for the other pics.

Image


Cool, thanks. Hopefully it's the one. :up:
Theflyingschoolgirl

Re: Mystery plane

Postby Wissam24 on Tue 30 Jan 2018, 9:55 am

I'm enjoying the efforts in the check-six forum as well. Gosh, how mysterious. Do we know where the photos were taken? It's hard to imagine at this point that it's not a custom-design, possibly a modified something else, or maybe even just some mock up of something? A Chimera of sorts? Worth researching the background aircraft too, to see if that yields some clues.
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Re: Mystery plane

Postby capercaillie on Tue 30 Jan 2018, 2:23 pm

The mystery job seems to have a deeper or squatter fuselage compared to your Maillet, its almost MS406 like in depth, but with a weedier engine and fixed undercarriage.

Perhaps its some one off air racing jobbie, the cut down fin and aerodynamic wheel spats give it that sort of look. So many aircraft were built around that time, never going into multi scale production, its going to be interesting to find out.
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capercaillie

Re: Mystery plane

Postby starbuck on Tue 30 Jan 2018, 3:45 pm

Is it definitely the same aircraft in all 4 photos? If it is it has obviously been moved at some point and even then the photos were not taken at the same time at each location (if that makes sense) as the picture taken from the elevated angle shows some kind of opening in the starboard wing above the wheel which isn't evident in the other pictures.

Also as to location there seems to be some kind of writing and roundel in the concrete in the 3rd photograph, don't know if this is significant to anyone?
starbuck

Re: Mystery plane

Postby Aviationcafe on Tue 30 Jan 2018, 4:02 pm

Could it be a Maillet 201?

From a bit of searching the large aircraft in the first photo looks similar to the Amiot 142/143
Aviationcafe

Re: Mystery plane

Postby Col. Chibani on Tue 30 Jan 2018, 5:43 pm

starbuck wrote:Also as to location there seems to be some kind of writing and roundel in the concrete in the 3rd photograph, don't know if this is significant to anyone?


You're right !
A quick search led me to "INTAVA" australian oil company logo :
Image

But I do not think that it means that these aircraft are "down under".
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Col. Chibani

Re: Mystery plane

Postby Berf on Tue 30 Jan 2018, 6:20 pm

Is the airfield Bordeaux?
Berf

Re: Mystery plane

Postby Col. Chibani on Wed 31 Jan 2018, 9:10 am

Berf wrote:Is the airfield Bordeaux?


Seems to be Villacoublay (near Paris).
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Col. Chibani

Re: Mystery plane

Postby Theflyingschoolgirl on Wed 31 Jan 2018, 4:14 pm

capercaillie wrote:The mystery job seems to have a deeper or squatter fuselage compared to your Maillet, its almost MS406 like in depth, but with a weedier engine and fixed undercarriage.

Perhaps its some one off air racing jobbie, the cut down fin and aerodynamic wheel spats give it that sort of look. So many aircraft were built around that time, never going into multi scale production, its going to be interesting to find out.


Col. Chibani, I am pretty sure there is an article regarding the purchase of the Maillet 201 type out there somewhere. I think, I'm correct in saying that, a (possibly 2) maillet 01 air-race frame, was trialled and the 201 evolved from it. I get loads of literature sent to me about WW2 liaison/trainer aircraft; I know I've read it somewhere. I can only ever recall seeing photo's of 201's though. The article I read actually boasted about the aircraft's air-race heritage and the retention of some features (I don't now how significant). Pretty sure (I may be wrong), that the maillet was actually tested at Villacoublay in that article. Hope you find out the story behind it.
Theflyingschoolgirl


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