Prestwick/Ayr airshow.

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Alanko
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Re: Prestwick/Ayr airshow.

Post by Alanko »

Great show yesterday! I went through with a friend (having had two others cancel at the last minute :mad: ). Unlike the previous two years I actually ended up walking most of the promenade and beach, so saw each display from a different vantage point. I was unkind about the lineup on here, but actually it was an impressively mixed bag, and the timings all seemed to work out pretty well. The Catalina hung around during the 2nd half of the BBMF, and was noticed by the teenage boys in front of us ("its a glider thingy!"). In line with the previous two Saturday displays at Ayr the Lancaster failed to show. This time it was apparently an issue with the pneumatics, though apparently it was at PIK earlier and appeared both at Portrush and the Troon Viking festival (Guy Gibson must have had a Swedish granny) today.

The SAR demo was good to see, and made up for HMS Gannet being called away last year. The Falcons were also impressive, jumping from a Cessna Skyvan having circled the area a few teams. I was down on the beach for the Typhoon, with a concrete wall behind me. Probably one of the louder displays, maybe because it wasn't looping? By contrast AeroSparx were very sedate, and the black smoke (did Brendan O'brien sound slightly jealous?) hung in the air like ink in water. My mate was impressed with the Extra 330, especially when it hung on its propeller for what felt like an aeon.

The Bronco/P-51/B-25 display was also impressive. They looked and sounded especially menacing heading out the gloom over the headland. Very nice to see all three, though the Bronco and B-25 were of more interest to me. The Vampire was maybe the first display that I thought was less impressive than at East Fortune. I felt the Vampire was a little further away. Like last year the security bods didn't seem to account for the tide coming in, so the crowd line seemed to get further away. This was put 'right' in the twin Vampire display though. Brendan commented that they came 'right up' to the display line, but I'm wondering if they actually inched over it.

The weather got slowly worse from hereon out, but the BBMF put in a spirited Spitfire and Hurricane display, the Catalina was as graceful as always and 'Wee Dram' managed a touch and go. The Reds put on a display that, if I heard correctly, mixed their flat and rolling displays. Their coloured smoke seemed to work especially well against the grey sky, hanging a bit like the inky smoke of the AeroSparx team. By the time they were finished entire sections of the sky had an odd purple hue to them, and the smell of it was pretty strong down on the beach.

Overall a very enjoyable day. Brendan does an amazing job of keeping it all going, often putting a positive spin on things. For example the poor weather meant that the Typhoon had to display closer to the crowd, and would therefore be noisier... he had a radar image of the incoming weather, and we were only going to get the edges of it... he had a few bits of dead air to fill and he did it pretty well. Whilst he claimed not to be a 'rivet counter' (his words) he dredged up a lot of facts and figures for most of the aircraft, until his notes were destroyed by the rain. He was clearly most enthusiastic about the aerobatics displays, giving a blow-by-blow account of what was occurring, almost like a competition judge. He did talk over some of the acts, however. For example I was pointing out the weird high-pitched oscillating sound coming off the Catalina to my mate, and it was hard to hear it over the near-constant chatter. I would have liked to have heard a bit more raw aircraft noise. The Vampires seemed pretty quiet, and one silent pass might have been nice? All in all glad I went, and look forward to next year.


7
16 – Red Arrows 16:46 – 17:11

stratocaster
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Re: Prestwick/Ayr airshow.

Post by stratocaster »

Aside from the shocking weather, another enjoyable airshow. However, I'll be better prepared for the evening display should there be another one. Still bitty in parts at the beginning, but that's just an opinion. It's a great shame the Lancaster was a no show, but the weather would have been a problem for it anyway. Highlights for me were the B25 Mitchell, the S.A.R. UT S92 from CHC, the phoon and arrows still pleased a lot of us, Blades and Aerosparx guys gave a fantastic display each and the Nanchang was a treat. One wee note, can we get the aerosparx display team back and also for them to appear at East Fortune next year?! :clap:
Card carrying aviation addict!

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Heidfirst
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Location: Glasgow

Re: Prestwick/Ayr airshow.

Post by Heidfirst »

Alanko wrote: Like last year the security bods didn't seem to account for the tide coming in, so the crowd line seemed to get further away. This was put 'right' in the twin Vampire display though.

The southernmost buoy drifted out, later displays were told to ignore it & work on the line from centre & northern.
The crowd line was put where the Coast Guard said was OK then as the day went on the CG obviously became concerned about the strength of the tide & had it moved back - they were seriously considering evacuating the whole beach just before the tide turned.

Alanko
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Re: Prestwick/Ayr airshow.

Post by Alanko »

We were a bit confused, in part because Brendan was telling us to get off the beach while there were sections of the beach with lots of folk resolutely staying put!

portagee01
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Re: Prestwick/Ayr airshow.

Post by portagee01 »

OK so I've taken a few days to dry out and take stock before commenting on this years show.

Firstly credit to the organisers on the variety and quality of the individual show items once again. That they got all of the show off pretty much on time with the scheduled breaks being the only times where there wasn't an aircraft in the sky.

It is unfortunate however that these breaks happen, the S92 and lifeboat demo was superb but because it 2 hours earlier than the airshow proper I wonder how many missed out on seeing it. Likewise the Falcon's coming in an hour before the main show...yes I understand that they had more than one jump that day which requires the repacking and transit time.

I suppose it did allow for a visit to the contents of the Low Green itself, an area was billed as the military village, and they weren't kidding, I don't think I've seen so many recruitment stands from all branches of the services in one place in years. There was a nice selection of vintage military and civilian as well, with the fire engines, and the always impressive stream engines.

Back to the show, and as it turned out High Grey cloud worked pretty well for most of the Display items, the afterburners and streaming vortices on the Typhoon are always impressive especially at that slightly lower level. Being across the country the Friday night wasn't possible for me, so I was curious to see what the Aerosprax could do in daylight. well who knew Black smoke on grey skies works a treat especially which the highly manoeuvrable gliders turning virtually on themselves and passing back through their own trails. The solo Extra Display was pretty good, I don't normally like commentary during a display, but Brendan O' Brien calling the names of the manoeuvres whist the pilot regained height/energy before the next move worked well on this occasion.

I don't know if the B25, Bronco and P51 fly as a trio on a regular basis down south, the individual displays were fine, but would liked to have see a few paired passes. The blades did well with their low performance, though they did seem to work off buoy number 3 rather than between 2 and 3 as a crowd centre.

The break again allowed the weather to play it's part in the proceedings, the Vampire pair were good, shame the MiG 15 couldn't make it. Does the Lanc have something against Ayr? It flew on Friday, took the huff (technical term) on Saturday but made it to it's Sunday commitments... Very strange. Neither the Cat nor the "wee Dram" were overly fussed by a bit of rain, with again the Reds closing, the Low skies holding their coloured smoke in the air between passes.

A couple of the can't be helped points...the beach at Ayr is great partly because of it's length but by how shallow the bay is, and by how far the tide goes out. But at the same time, when the tide is in, it comes right up to the Esplanade wall especially at the Low green and the closer you get to the town.
Because of that, it would be stupid to prevent the crowds gather on the beach under the esplanade while the tides out, but there needs to more of a plan to gradually move people back up off the beach and not end up with situations like I witnessed where by one person with his camera decided he wasn't moving until an aircraft had finished displaying...if at all, it took a Police officer standing over him to finally take the hint and pack up his seat, food and camera kit.
Perhaps for next year, depending on how the tide is of course, that PA announcements are made stating that whilst it's OK to be on the beach in front of the Low Green for now, the event staff working with the Coast Guards will be gradually moving the rope back throughout the day. So be aware you will be asked to clear this section of the beach later on.

The other can't be helped point, or can it? Is the length of the show and the breaks.
Again I can understand wanting to make it a full day event, with the funfair and various things going on in the various tents and areas during the day, but having the official opening at 10am, with single flying items at 11am and then noon, before 90 minutes of action another 50-60 minute break before running through to the end. As I commented last year on the same subject, I do understand that there are aircraft arriving from performances, or are performing at Prestwick before going on elsewhere. Also that some aircraft are overnighting so want a late slot. I also appreciate that the Display organisers don't have free run of the take-off and landing slots, and so have to fit in around the regular and scheduled services.

Hopefully next year we can the Marines back, which with the tide permitting can be run as the lead item of the display itself, if there has to be a break then please no more than a tea/coffee/toilet break of 30 minutes.

Credit where it's due, in last years thread I commented on Brendan OBrien. Well the same jokes were still in evidence though the he did manage to reduce the number of times he wanted babies and bras to be thrown in the air to the rather less annoying half dozen or so. Going instead for the for the Umbrella waves instead. Only making reference to Wee Dram in the context of the upcoming running order was a relief compared to last year where it sounded like it was used in every other sentence.
I'll finish on a positive, I also gave Brendan a bit of stick for what sounded like reading aloud wiki pages of various acts and their aircraft. Whatever his sources were this year, he at least had taken time to personalise his notes, so it sounded like he was passing on his knowledge and not just reading aloud...A big improvement.

Unknown74
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Re: Prestwick/Ayr airshow.

Post by Unknown74 »

Can anyone please confirm serials for the Aircraft which flew the displays on Saturday? Unfortunately I never made it on Friday and didn't manage to get to Prestwick Airport for the display aircraft and spares.

Commando
Posts: 328
Joined: Thu 16 Apr 2009, 12:51 pm

Re: Prestwick/Ayr airshow.

Post by Commando »

Some
Typhoon ZK352
B25 PH-XXV
P51 G-BIXL
Vampires LN-DHY and DHZ
OV10 G-ONAA/99+18
Rest I didn't bother with

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Heidfirst
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Location: Glasgow

Re: Prestwick/Ayr airshow.

Post by Heidfirst »

portagee01 wrote: with the scheduled breaks being the only times where there wasn't an aircraft in the sky.

It is unfortunate however that these breaks happen, the S92 and lifeboat demo was superb but because it 2 hours earlier than the airshow proper I wonder how many missed out on seeing it. Likewise the Falcon's coming in an hour before the main show...yes I understand that they had more than one jump that day which requires the repacking and transit time.

I suppose it did allow for a visit to the contents of the Low Green itself,

mmm, this is "by design" - the major income stream to pay for the show comes from the traders - the quid pro quo is that they have to be allowed a turn ...

A couple of the can't be helped points...the beach at Ayr is great partly because of it's length but by how shallow the bay is, and by how far the tide goes out. But at the same time, when the tide is in, it comes right up to the Esplanade wall especially at the Low green and the closer you get to the town.
Because of that, it would be stupid to prevent the crowds gather on the beach under the esplanade while the tides out, but there needs to more of a plan to gradually move people back up off the beach and not end up with situations like I witnessed where by one person with his camera decided he wasn't moving until an aircraft had finished displaying...if at all, it took a Police officer standing over him to finally take the hint and pack up his seat, food and camera kit.
Perhaps for next year, depending on how the tide is of course, that PA announcements are made stating that whilst it's OK to be on the beach in front of the Low Green for now, the event staff working with the Coast Guards will be gradually moving the rope back throughout the day. So be aware you will be asked to clear this section of the beach later on.

The Coast Guard are the lead agency for this - if they change their mind during the day as to where the crowdline needs to be everybody else has to go with it. At the start of the day briefing there was no mention of having to move it but the CG Officer in Charge on the day made the call ~lunchtime.
I am pretty sure that I know the incident to which you refer (a videographer with his son & a camera on a tripod?) as if so I too was there, he was trying to also argue with the CG Officer in Charge as well as the police, G4S, etc. - his son was much more sensible.

The other can't be helped point, or can it? Is the length of the show and the breaks.
Again I can understand wanting to make it a full day event, with the funfair and various things going on in the various tents and areas during the day, but having the official opening at 10am, with single flying items at 11am and then noon, before 90 minutes of action another 50-60 minute break before running through to the end. As I commented last year on the same subject, I do understand that there are aircraft arriving from performances, or are performing at Prestwick before going on elsewhere. Also that some aircraft are overnighting so want a late slot. I also appreciate that the Display organisers don't have free run of the take-off and landing slots, and so have to fit in around the regular and scheduled services.

Hopefully next year we can the Marines back, which with the tide permitting can be run as the lead item of the display itself, if there has to be a break then please no more than a tea/coffee/toilet break of 30 minutes.

Well, the tide needs to be out for the Marines to do a landing if you want an opposition position ... Especially if you would like pyro (& hopefully the senior police officer on the day doesn't get upset with that despite it having been coordinated with Police Scotland for months beforehand ... :whistle: ) because that needs a buffer zone to the crowd.
As I have explained already without breaks there would be no show (as indeed there would not be without volunteers, sponsors etc. - it really is on a knife edge financially itself although it brings a lot of money to the area). There were also other issues this year with changes in staff, obviously the changes in regulations etc. have also had an effect on display aircraft availability & display pilot currency, cost etc.
Hopefully it will get stronger year on year because I think that we are going to be seeing fewer shows throughout the UK & it's not as if we are exactly flush with them in Scotland ...

portagee01
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Joined: Tue 20 Sep 2011, 11:30 pm

Re: Prestwick/Ayr airshow.

Post by portagee01 »

Heidfirst wrote:
The Coast Guard are the lead agency ... as to where the crowdline needs to be everybody else has to go with it. At the start of the day briefing there was no mention of having to move it but the CG Officer in Charge on the day made the call ~lunchtime.
I am pretty sure that I know the incident to which you refer (a videographer with his son & a camera on a tripod?) as if so I too was there, he was trying to also argue with the CG Officer in Charge as well as the police, G4S, etc. - his son was much more sensible.


That wasn't the incident if you can call what I witnessed an incident. What I was saw just in front of the commentary bus, where a gent was taking still photos, he had a deckchair, and couple of bags. Despite being asked several times to start packing up he kept taking shots, in the end he and the police officer were the only ones on that part of the beach. Once the aircraft finished the guy packed his stuff up and both walked further South along the beach without any fuss. It has to be said that neither were in imminent danger of getting their feet wet, but that section of the beach was being cleared so he had to move.

I'm not local by any means (I live 60 miles away) but even I know that the closer to town (further North) you get, high tide comes right up to the wall of the Esplanade, given that's where the crowd centre was located, I find it very strange that the CG wouldn't have a plan to gradually thin the crowd out of that area either further down the beach where the water doesn't come in quite so far, or up onto the Esplande.

Well, the tide needs to be out for the Marines to do a landing if you want an opposition position ... Especially if you would like pyro (& hopefully the senior police officer on the day doesn't get upset with that despite it having been coordinated with Police Scotland for months beforehand ... :whistle: ) because that needs a buffer zone to the crowd.


And for me that goes with the organisers taking a plan to the CG for a moving crowd line. I appreciate the exact locations can't be plotted out, moving sands etc, but for me planning, for a crowdline "M" which has a buffer zone to the Marines. Once the area has been cleared then the crowdline in a controlled fashion be moved forward or back to be the main line for the day - that meets the separation from the display line requirements. However as the tide is due to come in, then a gradual retreat is put in place with PA announcements, something in the program explaining why the crowdline needs to change as the tide comes in as mentioned above.

As I have explained already without breaks there would be no show (as indeed there would not be without volunteers, sponsors etc. - it really is on a knife edge financially itself although it brings a lot of money to the area). There were also other issues this year with changes in staff, obviously the changes in regulations etc. have also had an effect on display aircraft availability & display pilot currency, cost etc.
Hopefully it will get stronger year on year because I think that we are going to be seeing fewer shows throughout the UK & it's not as if we are exactly flush with them in Scotland ...

None of my comments were meant as direct criticism of the organisers or any one particular person or group. They were simply my observations as an aviation enthusiast attending the airshow. The traders, charities, recruitment village, Local businesses and colleges are all a backdrop to this, and I do understand their importance in terms of revenues in order to create a free event.
I also understand that every airshow this year has come under close scrutiny what with changes of regulations, and that as a result the costs of booking items may well have increased. I agree that there may not be as many airfield type shows, especially in areas where towns have now surrounded the airfields, but I hope that the likes of Ayr's sea front show (and East Fortunes surrounded by agriculture) would be the kind to gain, and indeed build and strengthen.
So far we have had 3 great years at Ayr, I look forward to see what year 4 brings us.

Unknown74
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Joined: Thu 23 Jul 2009, 12:55 pm

Re: Prestwick/Ayr airshow.

Post by Unknown74 »

Wondering the IDs of the 9 Red Arrows Hawks which flew the display.....?

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