USA vs North Korea

Re: usa vs north korea

Postby DonaldGrump on Sun 13 Aug 2017, 8:48 pm

Brevet Cable wrote:
DonaldGrump wrote:nothing to do with the fact he is filling his y fronts because he knows Trump means it

Unfortunately, probably not.
Kim no doubt thinks he can carry on with his usual tactic of making threats then de-escalating them on the assumption that he's dealing with a sane POTUS, but fails to have noticed that Trump seems to be threatening to go to war with just about every Country which disagrees with him.



Kim must have those round him who understand that now isnt the time to push your luck as far as America goes. Yes under Obama's watch he could probably have invaded Japan and got away with it. As for Trump firing four three two or one missile in the direction of Guam is quite possibly going to result in Pyongyang taking delivery of a good supply of instant sunshine.

Unless Kim does something stupid and bides his time Trump will be gone before him, and when its something like president Michelle Obama he can then build as many nukes as he wants un checked.

I have no worries whatsoever over this current stand off, Trump will mouth off, North Korea will mouth back, before bottling it.

Should it suddenly come on the news that the silly sod has fired 4 missiles toward Guam I will then become very very worried indeed....but it wont happen, will it......
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Re: usa vs north korea

Postby Brevet Cable on Sun 13 Aug 2017, 10:59 pm

He's got the same people in the background 'advising' him as his father had ( some believe that the 'advisors' are rather more than that, and that they're merely letting him run the Country in the same way as they let his father run it )

The problem is that Trump's painted himself into a corner where all his options will make him a loser.
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Re: usa vs north korea

Postby boff180 on Sun 03 Sep 2017, 8:18 am

This morning NK detonated a compact Hydrogen-type Nuclear warhead reported to be small enough to fit on a missile.

The resultant tremor measured 6.3 on the Richter scale, analysts suggest this indicates a 100kt class weapon.

For comparison, that is the same yield as the warheads carried by Trident.

The pace of their nuclear development is astounding, some nation has to be helping them through back channels or they've successfully hacked a nuclear power to obtain the technology.

China is furious but who will be the first to say enough is enough?

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Re: usa vs north korea

Postby Craig on Sun 03 Sep 2017, 11:05 am

boff180 wrote:This morning NK detonated a compact Hydrogen-type Nuclear warhead reported to be small enough to fit on a missile.

The resultant tremor measured 6.3 on the Richter scale, analysts suggest this indicates a 100kt class weapon.

For comparison, that is the same yield as the warheads carried by Trident.

The pace of their nuclear development is astounding, some nation has to be helping them through back channels or they've successfully hacked a nuclear power to obtain the technology.

China is furious but who will be the first to say enough is enough?

Andy

I think the pertinent question is are they? It's easy making the required noises publicly but to date no one has been successful in shutting them down and in fact the pace of their development does seem to indicate someone is helping. There's a lot more to all this than we know I'm sure of that.
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Re: usa vs north korea

Postby CJS on Sun 03 Sep 2017, 2:43 pm

Is there any chance they could have independently figured it out? I'm not defending it - although I'm not always sure why one nation with a fruitcake idiot for a leader should be allowed nuclear weapons but another one isn't - but is it not possible they've done this on their own?

I don't imagine the USA ever shared much info with the Russians or vice versa, yet both have nuclear weapons.

Just a thought.
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Re: usa vs north korea

Postby Brevet Cable on Sun 03 Sep 2017, 3:18 pm

Take your pick of the rumours......some say Pakistan supplied the information ( if not the actual technology ), others accuse Ukraine of doing so.
Their nuclear reactors and associated technology were supplied by the Swiss....or to be more precise, the Swiss-based ( jointly Swiss-Swedish owned ) firm ABB.
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Re: usa vs north korea

Postby ericbee123 on Sun 03 Sep 2017, 3:23 pm

CJS wrote:
I don't imagine the USA ever shared much info with the Russians or vice versa, yet both have nuclear weapons.

Just a thought.


The USA didn't knowingly share nuclear secrets,unlike the British with the jet engine, but their spies got some Anerican information and they also captured lots of German scientists who were very near to developing a Nazi-Nuke.

The Russians then passed this technology onto the Chinese.

I'm not sure any one nation has ever "invented" nuclear weapons by themselves, including the USA.
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Re: usa vs north korea

Postby Spiny Norman on Sun 03 Sep 2017, 4:04 pm

Surely though, the North Koreans won't use nuclear weapons on American targets, or those allied to America, as the USA has its own nuclear weapons. This is how nuclear deterrence works.
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Re: usa vs north korea

Postby CJS on Sun 03 Sep 2017, 4:56 pm

In the hands of someone sane, perhaps.
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Re: usa vs north korea

Postby Brevet Cable on Sun 03 Sep 2017, 5:37 pm

Who.....Trump or Kim ? :whistle:
:biggrin:
Remember, one's got 'advisors' in the background who'll slap him down hard if he looks like doing something stupid.....the other's Donald Trump.

As posted previously, much of it revolves around the fear of regime change.

Not forgetting that the DPRK see the large-scale joint US-ROK exercises held just across the border as being provovative ( after all, the DPRK & UN-ROK are technically still at war with each other )
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Re: usa vs north korea

Postby CJS on Sun 03 Sep 2017, 6:50 pm

They were provocative wasn't that pretty much the point of them? Here we are and if you mess with us and our bigger boy friends we're gonna give you a big old slap...

And for the record, I was talking about both of them, but I hope that Trump's advisors are slightly less 'yes oh great and powerful one' than Kim's are (although I sometimes doubt it) and that they might be able to temper his nonsense a bit.
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Re: usa vs north korea

Postby Brevet Cable on Sun 03 Sep 2017, 7:32 pm

Ironically, Kim's 'advisors' ( the proper ones who are lurking in the background ) are anything but "yes oh great and powerful one", they're the same ones who were in charge....err, sorry, 'advising'.... when Kim senior was the boss.
The offing in various spectacular ways of a number of VSOs & Senior Officials ( including several of Kim's relatives ) shortly after Kim junior came to power was primarily down to an internal power struggle ( and a bit of score-settling ) amongst those who are believed to really wield the power, and they aren't about to let Kim do anything which will jeopardise that control.

Contrast that with Trump, who is getting through advisors like they're going out of fashion......he's either selecting unsuitable ones who quit because they're useless, or he's upsetting those who actually do know what they're doing until they quit in disgust.
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Re: usa vs north korea

Postby CJS on Sun 03 Sep 2017, 8:49 pm

Now I've got my head round your last sentence, I've figured it out - we're screwed aren't we?

I think we should close Mildenhall and Lakenheath quick, build houses on them, send the Americans home and pretend we never knew them...form an alliance with someone safer, Lichtenstein maybe, or Andorra.

We might not get nylon tights, but it might just save us. :-o :-P
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Re: usa vs north korea

Postby starbuck on Sun 03 Sep 2017, 10:25 pm

Spiny Norman wrote:Surely though, the North Koreans won't use nuclear weapons on American targets, or those allied to America, as the USA has its own nuclear weapons. This is how nuclear deterrence works.


It's for deterrence that Kim is rushing the nuclear programme as quickly as he is. North Korea is on its knees financially and as BC says Kim is more scared of foreign sponsored / assisted regime change than anything else.

Apparently our assisted removal of Gadaffis dictatorship in Libya along with Iraq scared Kim and he is convinced that had those countries had the bomb we would never have gotten involved and they would still be in power. Let's be honest he's probably right.
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Re: USA vs North Korea

Postby Brevet Cable on Sun 03 Sep 2017, 10:37 pm

When you've got SecDef Mattis, who's supposed to be sensible, coming out with the sort of rhetoric he did today ( http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-41140621 ) you have to hope that he's playing to the gallery, because if not Trump's and his "Hooah !" attitude will only exacerbate the situation.

You also have to laugh at Trump saying the US will stop trading with any Country doing business with the DPRK ( not that much of the business dealings are open anyway, much of it is reported to be done through third-party interests or shell companies outside the region )
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Re: usa vs north korea

Postby Spiny Norman on Mon 04 Sep 2017, 7:08 am

starbuck wrote:
Spiny Norman wrote:Surely though, the North Koreans won't use nuclear weapons on American targets, or those allied to America, as the USA has its own nuclear weapons. This is how nuclear deterrence works.


It's for deterrence that Kim is rushing the nuclear programme as quickly as he is. North Korea is on its knees financially and as BC says Kim is more scared of foreign sponsored / assisted regime change than anything else.

Apparently our assisted removal of Gadaffis dictatorship in Libya along with Iraq scared Kim and he is convinced that had those countries had the bomb we would never have gotten involved and they would still be in power. Let's be honest he's probably right.


But Iraq had weapons of mass destruction...
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Re: usa vs north korea

Postby Craig on Mon 04 Sep 2017, 7:44 am

Spiny Norman wrote:
starbuck wrote:
Spiny Norman wrote:Surely though, the North Koreans won't use nuclear weapons on American targets, or those allied to America, as the USA has its own nuclear weapons. This is how nuclear deterrence works.


It's for deterrence that Kim is rushing the nuclear programme as quickly as he is. North Korea is on its knees financially and as BC says Kim is more scared of foreign sponsored / assisted regime change than anything else.

Apparently our assisted removal of Gadaffis dictatorship in Libya along with Iraq scared Kim and he is convinced that had those countries had the bomb we would never have gotten involved and they would still be in power. Let's be honest he's probably right.


But Iraq had weapons of mass destruction...

But no ICBMs. Weaponry to use against your own people and neighbours is one thing, the ability to directly retaliate is another.
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Re: usa vs north korea

Postby Spiny Norman on Mon 04 Sep 2017, 10:13 am

Craig wrote:
Spiny Norman wrote:
starbuck wrote:
Spiny Norman wrote:Surely though, the North Koreans won't use nuclear weapons on American targets, or those allied to America, as the USA has its own nuclear weapons. This is how nuclear deterrence works.


It's for deterrence that Kim is rushing the nuclear programme as quickly as he is. North Korea is on its knees financially and as BC says Kim is more scared of foreign sponsored / assisted regime change than anything else.

Apparently our assisted removal of Gadaffis dictatorship in Libya along with Iraq scared Kim and he is convinced that had those countries had the bomb we would never have gotten involved and they would still be in power. Let's be honest he's probably right.


But Iraq had weapons of mass destruction...

But no ICBMs. Weaponry to use against your own people and neighbours is one thing, the ability to directly retaliate is another.


And also to use against an attacking force, no?

Where is the UN here? Other world leaders should be stepping up and calling for calm. Diplomatic efforts to diffuse this crisis should be made immediately. Trump has shown poor judgement up until now and he should be quietly led away from any nuclear button.
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Re: usa vs north korea

Postby Craig on Mon 04 Sep 2017, 12:20 pm

Spiny Norman wrote:
Craig wrote:
Spiny Norman wrote:
starbuck wrote:
Spiny Norman wrote:Surely though, the North Koreans won't use nuclear weapons on American targets, or those allied to America, as the USA has its own nuclear weapons. This is how nuclear deterrence works.


It's for deterrence that Kim is rushing the nuclear programme as quickly as he is. North Korea is on its knees financially and as BC says Kim is more scared of foreign sponsored / assisted regime change than anything else.

Apparently our assisted removal of Gadaffis dictatorship in Libya along with Iraq scared Kim and he is convinced that had those countries had the bomb we would never have gotten involved and they would still be in power. Let's be honest he's probably right.


But Iraq had weapons of mass destruction...

But no ICBMs. Weaponry to use against your own people and neighbours is one thing, the ability to directly retaliate is another.


And also to use against an attacking force, no?

Where is the UN here? Other world leaders should be stepping up and calling for calm. Diplomatic efforts to diffuse this crisis should be made immediately. Trump has shown poor judgement up until now and he should be quietly led away from any nuclear button.

Yes but extra precautions for attacking forces is still a world away from a potential attack on your own homeland.

As for the reaction to this, all utterly bewildering. It feels like calm heads are needed but thete' s precious little statesmanship to be found.
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Re: USA vs North Korea

Postby Brevet Cable on Thu 14 Sep 2017, 10:35 pm

Kim sticking two fingers up at Trump and chanting "Come and have a go if you think you're hard enough!" again, I see....
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-41275614
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Re: USA vs North Korea

Postby boff180 on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 5:00 pm

Interesting to note that during todays show of force involving live ordnance drops from a pair of B-1B, ROKAF F-15 and USMC F-35B.... the latter in "clean" configuration....

... the F-35B were also carrying live Aim-120 Amraams.

A little unnecessary?
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Re: USA vs North Korea

Postby CJS on Tue 19 Sep 2017, 5:58 am

Unnecessary in this instance or unnecessary full stop (or 'period'...ughh)?

If only the former then I suppose you could argue that if it's a show of force, you may as well show as much of it as possible. Don't want Kim's lot thinking they can take pot shots at Don's lot without making them really rather cross do we?

Did he have a Lewis gun sticking out the back of the cockpit too? :-o
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Re: USA vs North Korea

Postby ColeTheDemolisher on Fri 22 Sep 2017, 11:55 pm

North Korea threatens hydrogen bomb test in Pacific.

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