Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby LN Strike Eagle on Tue 10 May 2016, 2:59 pm

PirateTrickster wrote:none of us had attended a Shuttleworth display before.

There's your answer then. With all due respect, you have no benchmark to compare to. You've no idea what you missed out on, or how poor Sunday was in comparison.

Also, as I pointed out earlier in the thread - not "naysayers", just loyal customers that hold the place dear to our hearts. Big difference.
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Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby andygolfer on Tue 10 May 2016, 3:48 pm

I still enjoyed the show as a spectacle. Yes it was a bit limited in the lines and angles flown by some participants but I think we have to remember that Old Warden were the 2016 guinea pigs with all the new rules and a full house so maybe they were being extra careful to comply with a bit of a cushion rather than risk inadvertently overstepping (or rather overflying) the mark and incurring the wrath of the CAA.

The photography - which seems to be to focus (intended pun) of much attention was more of a challenge and was much more of a case of picking your moments, my exif data on my pics shows that I was around or above 300mm most of the time and sometimes on my max 400mm with a bit of cropping required but I prefer to crop afterwards anyway as I am rubbish at panning and end up missing a tail or nose off. I still got some that I was happy with though.

I really must see if I can find my old pics from 40 or 50 years ago, then you would see how much it has changed over the years!

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Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby pbeardmore on Tue 10 May 2016, 3:48 pm

I can easily imagine how a first timer , with great weather and the Reds would enjoy OW, but its human nature to compare the present with the past.
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Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby LN Strike Eagle on Tue 10 May 2016, 4:20 pm

Just thinking about it - if we're so in danger from a fence line that might get you 15 metres closer to the action that it needs to be straightened out, why are the Reds still permitted to overfly the crowd for their arrival?

What a bizarre formation it is too - commentary boasting about it being 900 feet across like that's a good thing? My first impression was that they weren't in formation.
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Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby andygolfer on Tue 10 May 2016, 4:27 pm

LN Strike Eagle wrote:Just thinking about it - if we're so in danger from a fence line that might get you 15 metres closer to the action that it needs to be straightened out, why are the Reds still permitted to overfly the crowd for their arrival?

What a bizarre formation it is too - commentary boasting about it being 900 feet across like that's a good thing? My first impression was that they weren't in formation.



maybe they class it as part of their transit flight to get around it , and maybe at a higher level to overcome the rules?

no wonder I couldn't get them all in the frame! perhaps they are not in formation so it can't be called a display :smile:
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Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby capercaillie on Tue 10 May 2016, 4:37 pm

LN Strike Eagle wrote:Just thinking about it - if we're so in danger from a fence line that might get you 15 metres closer to the action that it needs to be straightened out, why are the Reds still permitted to overfly the crowd for their arrival?

What a bizarre formation it is too - commentary boasting about it being 900 feet across like that's a good thing? My first impression was that they weren't in formation.


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Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby helired3 on Tue 10 May 2016, 5:13 pm

this may help explain the road and Rights of Way, closures

http://www.bedsparishes.gov.uk/northill ... ticeboard/
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Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby PirateTrickster on Tue 10 May 2016, 8:16 pm

LN Strike Eagle wrote:Just thinking about it - if we're so in danger from a fence line that might get you 15 metres closer to the action that it needs to be straightened out, why are the Reds still permitted to overfly the crowd for their arrival?

What a bizarre formation it is too - commentary boasting about it being 900 feet across like that's a good thing? My first impression was that they weren't in formation.


I maybe misremembering or misquoting, although I have it in my head that they are the only act permitted to do so. Although I don't have a good answer for why they are allowed to do that.

As for the formation - I just managed to fit them all in at 75mm.
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Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby AFC on Wed 11 May 2016, 7:37 am

LN Strike Eagle wrote:Just thinking about it - if we're so in danger from a fence line that might get you 15 metres closer to the action that it needs to be straightened out, why are the Reds still permitted to overfly the crowd for their arrival?

What a bizarre formation it is too - commentary boasting about it being 900 feet across like that's a good thing? My first impression was that they weren't in formation.


Maybe some new silly rules to make it safer, I mean the further away they are from each other, the less likely they are to crash into each other over the crowd, right?

Also there was that constant cross wind (if I remember correctly it was blowing towards the crowd?) maybe that could have had an effect on how far away all the acts flew? Maybe they were being overly cautious so that the wind didn't blow them closer than the minimum distance away from the crowd?
AFC

Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby Dan O'Hagan on Wed 11 May 2016, 7:59 am

helired3 wrote:this may help explain the road and Rights of Way, closures

http://www.bedsparishes.gov.uk/northill ... ticeboard/


If I was organising an airshow now, I'd probably not bother booking the Red Arrows.

"Exceptional circumstances" being a display unchanged, and safe, for at least 30 years. Wonder if other national teams visiting the UK would make such OTT demands for road closures?
Dan O'Hagan

Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby LN Strike Eagle on Wed 11 May 2016, 8:11 am

If that's what is required now for a Red Arrows display, I wish them the very best of luck at Farnborough, Biggin Hill etc.
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Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby Ian G on Wed 11 May 2016, 8:50 am

I meant to ask earlier but forgot, I noticed the P40 was smoking quite a lot when it parked up in front of the fence and I did see a pic here which showed a lot of fluid on the starboard side, can anyone elaborate as to what this was?
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Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby LN Strike Eagle on Wed 11 May 2016, 8:53 am

Ian G wrote:I meant to ask earlier but forgot, I noticed the P40 was smoking quite a lot when it parked up in front of the fence and I did see a pic here which showed a lot of fluid on the starboard side, can anyone elaborate as to what this was?

Coolant I think. Someone told me they'd overheard the owner saying it had been overfilled before departure.

Took them a while to get it all cleaned up.
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Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby King Cobra on Wed 11 May 2016, 9:14 am

LN Strike Eagle wrote:
Ian G wrote:I meant to ask earlier but forgot, I noticed the P40 was smoking quite a lot when it parked up in front of the fence and I did see a pic here which showed a lot of fluid on the starboard side, can anyone elaborate as to what this was?

Coolant I think. Someone told me they'd overheard the owner saying it had been overfilled before departure.

Took them a while to get it all cleaned up.


At departure time the engine started and then stopped. Some fiddling around "under the hood" and then everything seemed to be OK and off it went.
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Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby LN Strike Eagle on Wed 11 May 2016, 9:45 am

That was planned. He said to those standing behind it that he was going to run the engine for a minute and that it would get windy - presumably just a check before departure.
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Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby King Cobra on Wed 11 May 2016, 11:34 am

LN Strike Eagle wrote:That was planned. He said to those standing behind it that he was going to run the engine for a minute and that it would get windy - presumably just a check before departure.


Yes, it was a tad breezy when he ran up the engine. :)
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Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby Ian G on Wed 11 May 2016, 11:40 am

Thanks Dan for clearing that one up. Well, not literally. . .
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Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby Brevet Cable on Wed 11 May 2016, 11:59 am

LN Strike Eagle wrote:If that's what is required now for a Red Arrows display, I wish them the very best of luck at Farnborough, Biggin Hill etc.

Was it specifically for the RAFAT display , though , or would the same requirements have been in force if they'd had other aircraft which matched the same criteria ( jets & display speed ) ?
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Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby melcragg on Wed 11 May 2016, 12:13 pm

Good afternoon all. I joined today and this is my first post.

I enjoyed the display at Shuttleworth last October..... not just because the Vulcan was there but you could actually see the pilots and get up close.

This Sunday was very disappointing..... Watching distant aircraft. I think it would have been more exciting watching on the TV.

This exclusion zone if applied to RIAT would close the campsite I stay on. What are they going to do with local residents - evacuate them to a safe distance?

Eventually we will be confined to our houses wrapped in bubble wrap and dieing prematurely of boredom.
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Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby Dan O'Hagan on Wed 11 May 2016, 12:37 pm

melcragg wrote:Good afternoon all. I joined today and this is my first post.

I enjoyed the display at Shuttleworth last October..... not just because the Vulcan was there but you could actually see the pilots and get up close.

This Sunday was very disappointing..... Watching distant aircraft. I think it would have been more exciting watching on the TV.

This exclusion zone if applied to RIAT would close the campsite I stay on. What are they going to do with local residents - evacuate them to a safe distance?

Eventually we will be confined to our houses wrapped in bubble wrap and dieing prematurely of boredom.


A number of people told me on Sunday that evacuating homes in a certain radius was originally proposed by the Reds, only for them to finally concede to the more practical, but still unnecessary, road closures.

In the current mental climate, NOTHING would surprise me.
Dan O'Hagan

Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby Thoughtful_Flyer on Wed 11 May 2016, 1:09 pm

LN Strike Eagle wrote:If that's what is required now for a Red Arrows display, I wish them the very best of luck at Farnborough, Biggin Hill etc.


Indeed.

How then can the Red Arrows and the P de F display at Duxford without closing the M11? Or is it because the traffic will be moving, it is an offence to stop except in an emergency and there is no footpath it is OK?
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Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby paullangford on Wed 11 May 2016, 4:03 pm

LN Strike Eagle wrote:If that's what is required now for a Red Arrows display, I wish them the very best of luck at Farnborough, Biggin Hill etc.


Hi Dan,

Hasn't it already been talked about closing some roads for Farnborough anyway, didn't Farnborough issue some press release on that subject ?
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Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby stonojnr on Wed 11 May 2016, 8:54 pm

PirateTrickster wrote:
LN Strike Eagle wrote:Just thinking about it - if we're so in danger from a fence line that might get you 15 metres closer to the action that it needs to be straightened out, why are the Reds still permitted to overfly the crowd for their arrival?

What a bizarre formation it is too - commentary boasting about it being 900 feet across like that's a good thing? My first impression was that they weren't in formation.


I maybe misremembering or misquoting, although I have it in my head that they are the only act permitted to do so. Although I don't have a good answer for why they are allowed to do that.

As for the formation - I just managed to fit them all in at 75mm.


the Blades have done it in the pass, though they are ex Red Arrows pilots, and class themselves as an airline as well, so maybe there were some loopholes being exploited, but on the whole Id agree I think the Reds were the only ones who were potentially permitted to do it regularly/as part of the display
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Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby FTS on Wed 11 May 2016, 9:21 pm

stonojnr wrote:
PirateTrickster wrote:
LN Strike Eagle wrote:Just thinking about it - if we're so in danger from a fence line that might get you 15 metres closer to the action that it needs to be straightened out, why are the Reds still permitted to overfly the crowd for their arrival?

What a bizarre formation it is too - commentary boasting about it being 900 feet across like that's a good thing? My first impression was that they weren't in formation.


I maybe misremembering or misquoting, although I have it in my head that they are the only act permitted to do so. Although I don't have a good answer for why they are allowed to do that.

As for the formation - I just managed to fit them all in at 75mm.


the Blades have done it in the pass, though they are ex Red Arrows pilots, and class themselves as an airline as well, so maybe there were some loopholes being exploited, but on the whole Id agree I think the Reds were the only ones who were potentially permitted to do it regularly/as part of the display


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Re: Season Premiere Airshow Sunday 8 May 2016

Postby paullangford on Thu 12 May 2016, 8:17 am

FTS wrote:
stonojnr wrote:
PirateTrickster wrote:
LN Strike Eagle wrote:Just thinking about it - if we're so in danger from a fence line that might get you 15 metres closer to the action that it needs to be straightened out, why are the Reds still permitted to overfly the crowd for their arrival?

What a bizarre formation it is too - commentary boasting about it being 900 feet across like that's a good thing? My first impression was that they weren't in formation.


I maybe misremembering or misquoting, although I have it in my head that they are the only act permitted to do so. Although I don't have a good answer for why they are allowed to do that.

As for the formation - I just managed to fit them all in at 75mm.


the Blades have done it in the pass, though they are ex Red Arrows pilots, and class themselves as an airline as well, so maybe there were some loopholes being exploited, but on the whole Id agree I think the Reds were the only ones who were potentially permitted to do it regularly/as part of the display


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Isn't it about them 'not manouvering' as to why they can do it ?
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