RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby boff180 on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 3:31 am

One last thing, lets make it four negatives, and this will go into the feedback questionnaire if it's true. Saturday & Sunday morning the (effective & quick) shuttle bus starts at 07:45am. Right, I bet many people get up early and try and arrive early to take advantage of this, to get on base early.
I hear that there was a bus load of people at 07:45am were let off near the red entrance to find that no-one had arrived to set up the check in until 09:00am. Is that true? :shock:


Sounds like malarkey tbh. All volunteers had to be on base before the road closed and the event opened at 8.00.
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Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby bennysdad on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 5:37 am

CJS wrote:Why would they need to do that? They have earlybird tickets, so if you enjoyed it and you want to go back next year you'll get one of those.


They don't NEED to do it. It would be a nice gesture to acknowledge that their ticket prices were high this year for what was on offer and say thanks to supporters who supported their inaugural display.
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bennysdad

Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby CJS on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 5:52 am

True, it would be a nice gesture, but not if they think the ticket prices weren't high!

For comparison, how much was a Friday only RIAT ticket this year? Similar length flying display, arguably (quite easily actually) better flying display and certainly bigger and better static area.

DBH can then compare themselves with...themselves, to see if they need to acknowledge their prices were on the high side this year.
"Forewarned is forearmed"
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Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby Spiny Norman on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 7:22 am

speedbird2639 wrote:
you think it's your god given right to see 9 reds in the air


Given that 95% of the people who go to airshows are just Joe Public out for a nice day out with the kids and therefore they are going to be expecting to see the more populist types of displays such as the RAFAT and the BBMF.

So they must have been a bit bemused to pay £40 for a ticket only to be told the RAF are now incapable of maintaining their aircraft in airworthy condition long enough to complete a 40 minute display and that the team were a man down as Cpt Mumsnet had abandoned the team to rush off to be wrist deep in baby poop.

The whole sorry state is getting beyond satire and each day starts to look more like something from Mony Python/ Rutland Tv and less like the premier division of flyers from one of the Worlds most reputable air forces. Those who were clamouring for the Reds to be disbanded before they did irreversible damage to the reputation and by association the RAF's reputation may have been on to something.


The Cpt Mumsnet comment is a bit childish don't you think? Thankfully we live in a modern age where the service's priorities are more aligned to how we actually live nowadays. We're not on a war footing after all.

Reading comments on social media both on Saturday and Sunday the large majority were pro-Red Arrows. A few complained, but these were mostly enthusiasts. On Saturday most comments were praising them for putting on a show and understanding why things didn't always work out. Yesterday the comments after their flypast at the Great Northern Run were overwhelmingly positive with many saying how emotional they felt seeing them and after the Scampton show praise was forthcoming. As it was Mike Ling's last show in the UK there were many comments wishing him all the best for the future.

So, to sum up, they have not suffered 'irreversible damage' to their reputation. Quite the opposite in fact.
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Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby Wrexham Mackem on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 7:32 am

As someone qualified to comment as I went (and yes, that is a dig..), I can honestly say I'm pleased I did go. I'll gather my thoughts more as I work through my pics, but for me:

- organisation and event feel was professional, done to RIAT values. Felt like a mini-RIAT. Traffic no problem whatsoever, nor getting in and out. Although I did park on base.
- its good to get a new venue when I'm used to returning to the familiar every season. Some new things to see, new angles to photograph.
- there were some things, both flying and static, that you haven't seen anywhere else this year, but the flying display was wafer thin. I'm sure the organisers would acknowledge it. Surely they'll get better support from the military in future events - but they must.

As for the Reds' embarrassment at their own show, well that just put the top hat on the rotten luck the organisers have had this year. You couldn't make it up. And just adding after reading Norman's point above, yes, there was sympathy for them around me in the crowd, mostly.
its time to kick the tyres and light the fires
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Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby Finningley Boy on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 8:25 am

If I was to see things my way, I'd allow on site parking, there appeared to be plenty of grass with nothing on it apart from people milling around. This would have been used for parking at Waddington, Leuchars and Cosford. I assume Cosford still have on site parking? I was last their in 2015. I couldn't help thinking that more space could have been utilised also, the dilapidated state of much of the infrastructure gave the whole event a run down feel. You would scarcely have thought that this was an active RAF Air Base. Most importantly apart from the need to beef up the flying and static, the RIAT volunteers at this event, they seem far more given to this creeping attitude of trying to treat everyone as I if they're six years old. One lady in a bright red baseball cap, fleece with and all the gear, on duty at the Lincolnshire Showground, gushed at me as though I were a child, or simple, "Look at this lovely weather, wouldn't it be lovely if the planes were flying now!' I politely ignored her with a half smile. The next was a bloke about my age and girth stood at the entrance by the Hangars constantly waving a large red foam hand and trying to get the attention of everyone regardless walking through the gate, I said to him 'doesn't your arm get sore doing that?' he said no, cheerfully but ever so slightly defensively and carried on, so did I. I'm sorry but it is this very misplaced nonsense which I actually find depressing. Being at Scampton kept reminding me of what kind of event this would have been if organised by the RAF, say a quarter of a century or more ago. Personnel in best blues everywhere, Hangars, at least two, opened up, one the Exhibition Hall, the other Bandstand and refreshments. And of course a far more substantial static and flying line up. Flying probably not finishing until about 18.00hrs. This CBBC/CITV approach toward the punters has got to stop. :-X :cuppa:

FB :biggrin:
Last edited by Finningley Boy on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 9:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby T_J on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 8:39 am

Lightningkid70 wrote:
P.S Can anyone tell me why the crash barrier went up Sunday afternoon?
Martin


I guess it is at the discretion of whoever is in charge of the control tower. It might have been up on Saturday, but I don't recall. I've seen it up at RAF Scampton when the Reds are operating and it might be standard procedure.

One from 2009.

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=7751&hilit=scampton
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Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby B_Tank88 on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 8:54 am

I thought in general it was a good show, only the BBMF got hampered by wind conditions, everything else went up. Kudos to some of the acts getting out in that windy weather. Static was a little minimal but good quality, good fighter jets, the Swedes looked really interesting. The Typhoons afterburners looked great against the dull sky.

Can't help thinking though some of the acts were quite distant, a lot appears quite small on my 300mm lens. Had much closer shots at Cosford earlier this year.

In general it was a decent show, well organised, and a good platform for another one next year. I wonder if people can see future potential here.
B_Tank88

Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017?

Postby XX752 on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 11:21 am

Slappywag wrote:It's not happening.

End.


Just needed a little reminder of this..... :grin:

Sorry, couldn't resist
XX752

Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby stickshaker on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 11:49 am

T_J wrote:
Lightningkid70 wrote:
P.S Can anyone tell me why the crash barrier went up Sunday afternoon?
Martin


I guess it is at the discretion of whoever is in charge of the control tower. It might have been up on Saturday, but I don't recall. I've seen it up at RAF Scampton when the Reds are operating and it might be standard procedure.


Standard RAF procedure is for the barrier to be up for takeoffs and landings for those aircraft which are compatible with the specific barrier type. From what I've seen of the line up, that would be the Hawks and the JPs, probably the Vampires given their heritage, and maybe the Alpha Jet depending on its clearances.
stickshaker

Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017?

Postby speedbird2639 on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 11:54 am

XX752 wrote:
Slappywag wrote:It's not happening.

End.


Just needed a little reminder of this..... :grin:

Sorry, couldn't resist


I assume you are referring to n0143773's insistence that the Waddington show would not be returning, in his defence he is correct as the Waddington show hasn't returned and DBH have been bending over backwards to state that Scampton isn't a direct replacement for the departed Waddington show.

Now I would agree that you could argue that cancelling one air show in Lincs and starting another new show in Lincs at a similar RAF base a few miles is as close to a replacement as makes no difference...
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Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby andrewn on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 12:08 pm

B_Tank88 wrote:
Can't help thinking though some of the acts were quite distant, a lot appears quite small on my 300mm lens. Had much closer shots at Cosford earlier this year.


Yes I thought that too, for example Gizmo's show (BAF F-16) seemed more distant than usual, and much less impactful because of that. Conversely, as I was leaving the venue on Saturday the Typhoon came right across the front of me a couple of times - beautiful low level banking topside turns :)

In my opinion there's something very wrong with the Air Display regs when you get a better (closer) view of the displaying aircraft from a mile away outside the venue!
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Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017?

Postby XX752 on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 12:34 pm

speedbird2639 wrote:
XX752 wrote:
Slappywag wrote:It's not happening.

End.


Just needed a little reminder of this..... :grin:

Sorry, couldn't resist


I assume you are referring to n0143773's insistence that the Waddington show would not be returning, in his defence he is correct as the Waddington show hasn't returned and DBH have been bending over backwards to state that Scampton isn't a direct replacement for the departed Waddington show.

Now I would agree that you could argue that cancelling one air show in Lincs and starting another new show in Lincs at a similar RAF base a few miles is as close to a replacement as makes no difference...


No it was a dig when he said Scampton was not happening.
XX752

Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby Binbrook 01 on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 1:02 pm

For those not old enough to think back to 1995. :shock:

Remember the RAF actually closed Scampton, and sold off all the MQs outside the base. The only reason they reopened it, was down to the team that flys them Red painted jets.... as Cranwell got a bit crowded in 2000.

Otherwise it would have been further abandoned and probably gone the same way most others in the UK have.

As for the show I didn't go this time, maybe next year.?
Binbrook 01

Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby BossMann on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 2:09 pm

Went on Sunday. Used the Park and Ride at the Lincolshire Showground - no problems getting in or out.

Shuttle buses were plentiful and transfer was fine to the base.

The Showground: RAF Scampton looks like it could do with some TLC as mentioned above. It basically felt like a 'mini-RIAT' with the same signage and even the sounvenir programme tents were the same ones from RAF Fairford with the Air Tattoo logos. It was a 'mini-RIAT' set up with the service stations and enclosures on the flightline which were full.... the only thing that wasn't like a 'mini-RIAT' was the flying.

The statics: in 2 main areas with the fast jets (Typhoons, Cf18, F16s, Su22/ F4F/ Hunter) in one and the rest in the other (including RAF Hawk/ Tucano/ tutor/ prefect/ Kingair), reaminder scattered around the showground but were small civvie fly in types.

The flying: Highlights were the Belgian F16 ( no flares ??? so only at Yeovilton then), French Alphajet solo, 727 ( was a few flypasts rather than display ) Reds, Typhoon and the Global Stars who were stepping in for the ex Red Arrows Blades that were away at Sanicole. The Gyrocopter wasn't suited to the large airfield, much better at Seaside shows. The Gazelle Squadron only displayed as a solo?? was expecting a 2 ship display??. The Strikemaster/ JP duo could have done the airfield attack demo as at RAF Cosford as the AAC apache was absent. The KC135 flypasts were very distant...

However, it did seem very empty yesterday with the crowd only 1 person deep with gaps at 11am, didn't improve much during the day. The enclosures were full however so that's where the 24000 attendance figure may be from.

So it basically felt like a 'mini RIAT' but the flying wasn't of 'mini-RIAT' quality, with Yeovilton, Biggin Hill and RAF Cosford having more foreign participants. Many on the crowdline said how expensive it was for 5 hours of seaside flying displays.... hopefully this can be looked at for 2018 now that DBH know that an airshow can take place at RAF Scampton. Hopefully next year they can get all the RAF/ AAC/ Navy displays plus any special RAF 100 flypasts ( a la RIAT ), but then target the Red Arrows 'friends' and attract foreign aerobatic teams, mixing it with foreign solo/ duo/ heli displays - a military airshow with the odd civilian display.

The provisional dates are the 8/9 Sep 2018 - clashing with the Belgian Air Force Air days at Kleine Brogel and the Czech International Air Fest celebrating 100 years of the Czechoslovak air Force............
BossMann

Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby Unknown74 on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 6:06 pm

Hi BossMan, with regards the Belgian F-16 and the Flares issue, Unless you are only referring to on base Airshows he deployed Flares at Ayr Low Green for The Scottish International Airshow although I must admit they were over Water.
Unknown74

Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby Reds Rolling on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 6:31 pm

Dan O'Hagan wrote:
boff180 wrote:
Dan O'Hagan wrote:I'm not at the £40 farce, but have had texts telling me that both the BBMF (presumably a butterfly farting within 50 miles) and Aldi Rafale (tech) have cancelled from today's thrilling, value-for-money line-up.

Combined with "Cpt Mumsnet" ( :clap: :clap: :clap: ), what a weekend for the RAF, at their own show.

Strange I'm watching the Typhoon close the show right now...


I shall chastise my texter accordingly.

It appears your 'sources' don't really seem to know what they're talking about lately. :lol:
Reds Rolling

Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby PeterR on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 6:57 pm

Interesting to see that for all the bashing online in the preceding months, most of those who attended enjoyed themselves. I went on Sunday and apart from the weather, had an enjoyable day. The site had an interesting feel, some Waddington influences came shining through but overall it did feel like a 'mini-RIAT' with the blue cones, zoned flags, service stations etc etc. Have to admit I didn't watch the whole flying display, as I was out and about exploring the showground, but the items that did impress me were the Pembroke (plenty of lovely topside passes from JC), French Alpha Jet, Global Stars and of the course the B727 for novelty value. The stars of the static were laid out photogenically and once the sun came out at about 1730 on Sunday I took full advantage of that! An assortment of debrief points for the team to consider, and I'm sure they will, but overall they did deliver a good day-out.
PeterR

Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby minnie the moocher on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 7:21 pm

BossMann wrote:Went on Sunday.

However, it did seem very empty yesterday with the crowd only 1 person deep with gaps at 11am, didn't improve much during the day. The enclosures were full however so that's where the 24000 attendance figure may be from.


Agree with most of what you say - however this bit had me wondering if I was at the same show. We were right next to the enclosure with the vacant white plastic seats it was less than half occupied. Agreed the crowd was quite sparse until gone 12 and only started to fill in a bit after the flying had already started but didn't fill in appreciably where we were - apart from the idiot who chose to barge his way through and stand directly in front of some of us who had been there ages - I think if he wasn't built like a brick s****house somebody may have said something. Felt sorry for the bod in the icecream van near us. Don't know how much they paid for that pitch? Perhaps if the weather had played ball it would have helped. I mostly enjoyed the show but next time will hang on for tickets and not commit my cash until I know what is going to be there - and any increase in ticket price next year and I'm sorry but thats me out.
minnie the moocher

Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby MarkL on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 7:52 pm

PeterR wrote: the B727 for novelty value.



How very dare you ? Highlight I would say........
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Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby Danny on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 7:59 pm

minnie the moocher wrote:One of the very best aspects of the show was that there were plenty of loos

:grin:
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Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby hunterxf382 on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 8:28 pm

It would appear that the Autogyro that was displaying at Scampton had an incident on departure earlier today...crew unhurt according to official source:

http://scamptonairshow.com/news/2017/sep/11/statement-11/09/2017
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Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby T_J on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 9:15 pm

hunterxf382 wrote:It would appear that the Autogyro that was displaying at Scampton had an incident on departure earlier today...crew unhurt according to official source:

http://scamptonairshow.com/news/2017/sep/11/statement-11/09/2017


Don't think that it was the same one. The Autogyro that was displaying departed on Sunday.
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T_J

Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby hunterxf382 on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 9:23 pm

Was there one on static too perhaps?
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Re: RAF Scampton Air Show 2017

Postby Wrexham Mackem on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 9:50 pm

hunterxf382 wrote:Was there one on static too perhaps?


There was indeed.
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