F1 2011

Re: F1 2011

Postby Cimmerian on Sun 09 Oct 2011, 7:51 am

Well done, Lewis. Didn't hit anyone until the 22nd lap! :smile:

Well done, Jemson. Great result.

Congratulations, Sebastien. Double world champion.
Regards, Ken
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Re: F1 2011

Postby stuart n on Sun 09 Oct 2011, 9:29 am

Cimmerian wrote:Well done, Lewis. Didn't hit anyone until the 22nd lap! :smile:




:lmao: :lmao:

Wasn't his fault though was it, never is :wink:
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Re: F1 2011

Postby Danny on Sun 09 Oct 2011, 10:02 am

Was a good race this morning, Suzuka really is a fantastic track and the fans are great too. :clap:
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Re: F1 2011

Postby Tonka 617 on Sun 09 Oct 2011, 10:49 am

Great race, Suzuka is an awesome track... borderline at the start with Vettel and JB but great to see Jenson take the win
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Re: F1 2011

Postby LN Strike Eagle on Sun 09 Oct 2011, 12:13 pm

Great race from Jenson today, finally picking up that win in the dry for McLaren.

Well done to Vettel too - the comparison with his teammate in the same car shows how well he's driven in 2011, as does his finishing record. The foundation has been his stunning Saturday pace though IMO.
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Re: F1 2011

Postby stuart n on Sun 09 Oct 2011, 5:58 pm

Fancied Jenson to win after he qualified second and he delivered the goods. Another great drive and the way he looks after his tyres reminds me of Prost.
Vettel deserves to be champion he's had a fantastic season :clap: Will be interesting to see how the 2012 regulations affect things next season
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Re: F1 2011

Postby Stuka on Sun 09 Oct 2011, 10:37 pm

Vettel for the next 15 / 20 years? :yahoo: The best German driver since the last ONE! :rock:
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Re: F1 2011

Postby phreakf4 on Mon 10 Oct 2011, 10:27 am

stuart n wrote:...Will be interesting to see how the 2012 regulations affect things next season....


Since the "blown diffuser" is not permitted next season, I strongly suspect that Red Bull's current advantage in high-speed corners will be at least reduced or possibly completely eradicated. We already know that the Red Bull is down on top speed compared to the other teams. I expect both McLaren and Ferrari (and possibly Mercedes also) to be much more on even terms with Red Bull than has been the case this year.

It will indeed be interesting to observe (if I am right) how well Vettel manages against Button, Hamilton, Alonso et al without such a notable car advantage.
We are Borg:.....Resistance is Fruity...
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Re: F1 2011

Postby stuart n on Mon 10 Oct 2011, 10:39 am

Hamilton shouldn't be too much of a threat unless he stops crashing into people :wink:
It's normally the case that the driver in the fastest car wins the title, Jenson, Mikka, Kimi, Lewis all had clear advantages in their cars when they won their titles and the car Damon Hill won his title in was from a different age to the rest of the field.
It's all about how engineers design their cars around the rules, and there's no getting away from the fact that Adrian Newey designs faster cars than most other designers.
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Re: F1 2011

Postby phreakf4 on Mon 10 Oct 2011, 12:16 pm

I would certainly agree that Adrian Newey designs "quicker" cars (i.e his cars can [generally] give better lap times rather than being "faster"meaning that they are faster in a straight line). I wonder if the next Red Bull will cause Newey to come to terms with his dislike of KERS as Red Bull's current "mini-KERS" could be a significant disadvantage next year.

It is indeed common for the driver in the fastest car to win the championship, this was especially the case with Nigel Mansell and the Williams, as long as he didn't break the car, he was virtually guaranteed to win.

Currently, however, with the notable exception of Red Bull, there is very little to choose between the front-running teams and strategy has become ever more important. It seems likely that Mercedes and Force India will continue to become more competitive and provided they can find the finance Sauber should continue to improve, with the result that the gap between the "front-runners" and the "mid field" may be less. Unfortunately it seems that Wiliams's decline continues, a pity to see a once great team reduced to it's present state, only just ahead of the "new teams", who will hopefully also continue to develop their cars.

I also wonder whether Pirelli will supply tyres which degrade slightly less than the current versions, I for one do not really like to see races won or lost in the pit lane. Two pit stops (or maybe three in exceptional circumstances) should be all that are required to give an interesting race where most of the competion takes place on the track, rather than, as has been the case sometimes this year, four or more stops being necessary simply to ensure that the car is able to stay on the track. The problem as I see it is that when tyres "fall over the edge" as these do, there is little or nothing that even the most able driver can do to drive round the problem and it results in most of the teams having no option but to follow the same or very similar strategies. That is very different to watching a superb driver managing to stay ahead on steadily-degrading tyres when there is a much wider "pit window"and also, as a consequence of the slower degradation, a less obvious "crossover" between compounds.
We are Borg:.....Resistance is Fruity...
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Re: F1 2011

Postby tornadof3spotter on Mon 10 Oct 2011, 12:36 pm

Lewis Hamilton WDC 2012 :win: :win:

McLaren WCC 2012 :win:
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Re: F1 2011

Postby Tonka 617 on Mon 10 Oct 2011, 3:44 pm

Without the blown diffuser i have a feeling Red Bull will be knocked off of their perch as that has played a big part in their performance this year, if i remember rightly they were the team worried the most about the blown diffuser being banned.

Without the huge advantage Vettel has had to be able to park himself on pole so many times as he has done i doubt he would win too many races, from what i remember last year he had quite a few incidents when he was racing wheel to wheel for position on track, more memorable for me was Turkey with Webber and Spa with Button. I am in no way disputing Vettel is very very quick but i think he is lacking in the race craft department
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Re: F1 2011

Postby timuss on Thu 13 Oct 2011, 1:27 pm

Some nice pics of one of Red Bull's cars being taken for a spin around the Himalaya's:

http://www.topgear.com/uk/photos/red-bu ... ?imageNo=0
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Re: F1 2011

Postby Dragon Rapide on Thu 13 Oct 2011, 1:57 pm

Someone suggeted an axiom for F1 which isn't a bad guide - the fastest car with the fastest driver will always win, the fastest car with an average driver will often win, but the slowest car with the fastest driver will never win. F1 21st century is predominantly about the finer technicalities of the car and its set-up. And that, for me, makes it far less interesting or exciting than when the drivers' skills were really tested.
Listen to that Gipsy music.....

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Re: F1 2011

Postby stuart n on Fri 14 Oct 2011, 4:25 pm

Tonka 617 wrote: I am in no way disputing Vettel is very very quick but i think he is lacking in the race craft department


From what we've seen this season I disagree, the way he went past Alonso in Italy with 2 wheels on the grass at the best part of 200MPH was breathtaking.
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Re: F1 2011

Postby Dragon Rapide on Fri 14 Oct 2011, 7:54 pm

Perhaps that's why he is considering his future, whilst Button has committed to McLaren.
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Re: F1 2011

Postby phreakf4 on Fri 14 Oct 2011, 11:45 pm

DanO1978 wrote:
tornadof3spotter wrote:Lewis Hamilton WDC 2012 :win: :win:

McLaren WCC 2012 :win:


Lewis has been shown up for what he is, by his vastly superior, and more gentlemanly, team-mate. Before he starts thinking of another world title, he'd do well to copy Jenson's manners, race etiquette and smooth driving style...


It is perhaps unfortunate that being a well-mannered gentleman is no advantage for a racing driver, but that's the way it is. It is common for successful (and also not so successful) racing drivers (in any class) to be self-centrered, obnoxious prima donnas. I have had to deal with a few.
It is because I was so successful at handling one particular driver, the son of a friend who owns a car servicing business, that I still, several years after we stopped racing because he could not afford to progress to another class (either sports-prototypes or F3) get my servicing and MOTs for free as a mark of gratitude.

I am a great fan of Jenson Button, but I am prepared to admit that Lewis is the quicker driver (i.e. he is capable of producing a faster lap than Jenson, all other things being equal). However it must also be admitted that Lewis seems to have "lost the plot" this year. He is still a great racer but rather than smoothing off his rough edges, which most F1 drivers do with experience, he has if anything become more rough and excessively aggressive. Lewis posesses his idol's (Senna's) ability to get more out of the car than it should be capable of delivering. If he could just balance that with better racecraft, I see no reason why he should not achieve more championships as long as he can stay with a top team.
We are Borg:.....Resistance is Fruity...
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Re: F1 2011

Postby Dragon Rapide on Sat 15 Oct 2011, 7:34 am

Interesting comments. Not being as intimately associated with the sport and its participants as you are, would I be right in saying that Vettel does not fit the prima donna stereotype you have described? It is perhaps simplistic but the most successful in most sports seem to possess elements of the behaviour you described so when champions are not, it is really refreshing.

I would like to see Hamilton suppress his demons, because I think he is extremely talented.
Listen to that Gipsy music.....

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Re: F1 2011

Postby phreakf4 on Sat 15 Oct 2011, 7:54 am

Dragon Rapide wrote:Interesting comments. Not being as intimately associated with the sport and its participants as you are, would I be right in saying that Vettel does not fit the prima donna stereotype you have described? It is perhaps simplistic but the most successful in most sports seem to possess elements of the behaviour you described so when champions are not, it is really refreshing.

I would like to see Hamilton suppress his demons, because I think he is extremely talented.


Since I do not know Vettel personally, I can not say whether his attitudes truly are those which he shows as his "public face". He is clearly capable of the petulance typical of racing drivers as has been seen following his involvement in a number of "racing incidents" where (as most drivers do) he attempted to lay all the blame at the feet of the other driver. To be fair though, humility is another trait which is of little use to a racing driver, they must believe that they are (or can be, given the right car) the best, else they should not be in the car.

Really good to see Lewis back on form today, not to mention that the poster who claimed before the Japanese GP that F1 was no longer interesting "because the winner is a foregone conclusion" seems to have spoken too soon.....nothing is for ever, especially in F1, or indeed most motorsports.

I am not in the least surprised to see McLaren catch up to Red Bull, the only aspect that is surprising is that they have taken much longer than I expected. McLaren have long shown that they are amongst the best in the sport at developing the car through the year, it is one reason why experienced F1 watchers/participants say "never write off McLaren".
We are Borg:.....Resistance is Fruity...
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Re: F1 2011

Postby Stuka on Sat 15 Oct 2011, 6:03 pm

After todays action in Korea, did anybody notice that Lewis H looked and sounded depressed?
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Re: F1 2011

Postby A40-BP on Sun 16 Oct 2011, 3:36 pm

Good race! Shame Jenson couldnt give Webber more of a fight. I think the end result was entirely predicable, Vettel deserved that win. Not that he hasnt had enough or anything mind...

Also, anyone noticed that the Indian GP is at 0930 our time! Since when has there been half hour time zones!?

7
With dumb bombs and retarded bomblets, why don't they just use stupid missiles?
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Re: F1 2011

Postby Stuka on Sun 16 Oct 2011, 5:03 pm

A40-BP wrote:Good race! Shame Jenson couldnt give Webber more of a fight. I think the end result was entirely predicable, Vettel deserved that win. Not that he hasnt had enough or anything mind...

Also, anyone noticed that the Indian GP is at 0930 our time! Since when has there been half hour time zones!?

7

For a long time. :smile: Get out and move about more>
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Re: F1 2011

Postby A40-BP on Sun 16 Oct 2011, 10:39 pm

Well obviously you'll see them in an atlas, i meant i have never seen them recognised before, ie the pilot never tells you to put your watches forward or back half an hour, plus this is the first GP i know of starting on the half hour mark.

7
With dumb bombs and retarded bomblets, why don't they just use stupid missiles?
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Re: F1 2011

Postby stuart n on Mon 17 Oct 2011, 6:50 am

Fair play to Lewis, I've given him plenty of stick but yesterday was much more like it. Agressive but controlled. :clap:
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Re: F1 2011

Postby PhilW on Mon 17 Oct 2011, 9:02 pm

stuart n wrote:Fair play to Lewis, I've given him plenty of stick but yesterday was much more like it. Agressive but controlled. :clap:

I can't see Webber being at RB next year. It's clearly (just) a faster car than the McLaren, but Lewis' ability was too much for him. Webber's boby language at the driver's interviews after the race (and avoiding the questions and praising the RB team to the hilt) even out-fedupped Lewis! :grin:
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