Validation

[mosquito]

Couple of questions for the guys in the know;

Is validation a requirement for all shows or just the bigger ones, Riat, Waddo, Farnborough etc and is it just for display teams?

Do all display acts rehearse their routine before the show or is it down the individual (s)?

Many Thanks

[Steve Atkin]

In my experience its pretty much just Farnborough that has a formal pre-show display validation process. Apart from that the CAA requires maintenance of currency in the type being displayed. Some display acts rehearse, some don't - its down to preference, currency, how early it is in the season, frequency of displays etc...

[Fentiger]

Depends, Farnborough is fairly unique due to its location. I was fortunate enough to meet some of the validation team from Farnborough last week at various receptions and they like all planes to validate their display before the event due to its location (in controlled airspace, in the middle of a very built up area) to allow the aircrew to familiarise themselves with the surroundings and allow the validation team to view the display in the confines of the airfield. It is also worth pointing out they like the displaying aircraft to validate a good and poor weather display as part of the process if needed.

Other shows such as waddington ask participants to validate before the display with the exception of the RAF display teams.

Also, a flypast does not require validation generally.

To answer your question, it really depends on the show and local regulations.

[Mixed grill]

I'm confused I was under the understanding that before any civil acts could display at an airshow a DA was needed and to get the said DA the display must be flown 3 times (Not in the same flight) at least one of the said displays must be in front of a CAA display examiner.

Have I got it wrong or have things changed ?

[Mike]

Mixed grill, that's a different thing altogether. A DA is required by the CAA for a pilot to be able to display at any public event in the UK. A validation is a separate requirement by certain shows, and is specific to that show only.

[SilentFlight]

Validations used to be a requirement in the rule books for all foreign participants (Non UK DA holders / Non UK Mil PDA holders) to establish that their displays were safe and conformed to the Lateral separation distances as laid down in the then JSP 550 (Now MRP Fly 2000 series RA 2335) / CAP 403 and NATO STANAG 3533. Validations would be carried out in front of the flying control committee and the Display Director, who watch the display make constructive remarks and may suggest the removal or slight alterations, where safe, to adjust the display to conform to the UK regulations in certain circumstances. In many cases including Waddington we still like to validate displays prior to the team or aircraft displaying in front of the public, to ensure that the displays are safe, conform to the regulations and it also provides the crews chance to familiarize themselves with the layout and local area.

The general trend would be and still is that once a display item has displayed in the UK once that year at one venue, the display has then been 'validated'. Although in the current set of regulations there is no formal requirement to do so, it is still seen as a best practice idea as a fall back to ensure all is well with the display, for example the crowd overflight issues last year at Waddington last year with the Thunderbirds.

Farnborough is slightly different and requires all its participants to validate as there are site specific rules and gated heights that must be met over certain parts of the display area, this applies to all participants including the UK based civil and military acts.

A PDA (Public Display Authorisation) for UK military and a civil DA (Display Authorisation) are merely the permission to carry out display flying at given heights, speeds and levels. A military PDA specifies a set routine, which little or no deviation is permitted, without further authorisation and approval from the star level officer, normally the Air Officer commanding the particular group an RAF aircraft belongs to. A civil DA allows a bit more freedom and specifies only an aircraft category (weight/performance), types of manoeuvres permitted, formation, tail chase and leader limits and finally the heights lowest height the pilot is permitted to come down to. It does not prescribe a specific routine.

Hope that helps solve the question. In short it is a final check of a display for safety, not compulsory, but a good idea1

[APG]

Farnborough is unique due to the location and the aerial rules that are set, also some of the aircraft that take part are prototypes and some it could be their first display.

Everybody is treated the same.

And if you saw the T-50 first validation flights your know why everyone has to validate

[Macc]

It is also worth pointing out they like the displaying aircraft to validate a good and poor weather display as part of the process if needed.

I'm intrigued. Quite frequently at RIAT you will see an aircraft attempting two rehearsal slots, i.e. this year the PolAF MiG-29 and Irkut Yak-130. Although both didn't get to do these because of the weather would one of the slots aim to be a high and the other low display regardless of the weather or do they just rehearse the show suited for the weather.

For example, if by some divine miracle we had 3 arrivals days full of optimal flying conditions for high displays would they practice the low display too or just do the high display twice?

Chris

[st24]

It is also worth pointing out they like the displaying aircraft to validate a good and poor weather display as part of the process if needed.

I'm intrigued. Quite frequently at RIAT you will see an aircraft attempting two rehearsal slots, i.e. this year the PolAF MiG-29 and Irkut Yak-130. Although both didn't get to do these because of the weather would one of the slots aim to be a high and the other low display regardless of the weather or do they just rehearse the show suited for the weather.

For example, if by some divine miracle we had 3 arrivals days full of optimal flying conditions for high displays would they practice the low display too or just do the high display twice?

Chris

From past experience RIAT seem quite content with any safe rehersal be it a high or low show, can't recall deliberate attempts for pilots to have a bash at varying sequences. Multiple practices are usually due to several dispaly pilots for one type - think of solo turk last year what was it 4 practices or so for 3 display pilots?? or the fact that the pilot is not all that "used" to display flying - such as the BAe Tiffy and various foreign crews with few display hours. The French Apha Jet and Mirage 2k always had 2 pilots and so they both validated separately. The need for rehearsing has proven it's worth any times - I'm sure many recall the Russian AF Su30 tailsliding over the crowd, Jordanian Aviojet displaying over the crowd and the Kuwaiti Red Hats -

[ILoveLightnings]

I was there when the Russian Su 30 did the tailslide over the Grandstand they used to put up in the Park and View (bring it back please it was great) Scary moment but I got some shots of it ( My to do list includes scanning years of prints ) Can't remember much scary about the Kuwaiti Hornet team, other than they were a bit all over the place and fast and noisy
Must admit my ideas about validations changed a bit after the Migs collided at Fairford, It also altered my perception of the risks of being "liveside" at shows. A week after the Migs went in, was the show at Valley. I remember watching the 2 French F1's (Voltige Victor) from liveside, rwy 19 approach and feeling very uncomfortable with them so close and overhead. But that is a different debate entirely Anyone for the Naughty Field??