Croatian Wings of Storm no more

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PeterR
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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by PeterR »

Interesting thread drift..! :snack: Have to say I was very disappointed with the news, having only seem them display once (AIR14), but I was very impressed with their routine. Add a smoke system and they would have been one of Europe's top teams!

Regarding a future Qatari team, personally I think airshows should be apolitical. As has been highlighted by some, other countries that have participated in past events also do not have perfect human rights, legal, ethical, moral values etc etc. I think we'd be lowering ourselves to their level by saying "you're not welcome", thinking of the foreign relations implications also.

Final point, the Pilatus PC-21 is far from a "Crop Duster" and I think a formation display team in a suitable colour scheme and smoke system could be a class act.

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Pablo
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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by Pablo »

PeterR wrote:Interesting thread drift..! :snack: Have to say I was very disappointed with the news, having only seem them display once (AIR14), but I was very impressed with their routine. Add a smoke system and they would have been one of Europe's top teams!

Regarding a future Qatari team, personally I think airshows should be apolitical. As has been highlighted by some, other countries that have participated in past events also do not have perfect human rights, legal, ethical, moral values etc etc. I think we'd be lowering ourselves to their level by saying "you're not welcome", thinking of the foreign relations implications also.

Final point, the Pilatus PC-21 is far from a "Crop Duster" and I think a formation display team in a suitable colour scheme and smoke system could be a class act.


Exactly right and very well said, Peter.

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aviodromefriend
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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by aviodromefriend »

jon93 wrote:Can you call Qatar Emiri Air Force display team a national display team if it's made up of Croations?
They will already have been given Qatarian passports by now, I guess.
DanO1978 wrote:I take it you're OK with a country who deny a visa to anyone who has visited Israel?
Given the fact that RIAT was allowed to invite that country, at least the UK government does.
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st24
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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by st24 »

DanO1978 wrote:I take it you're OK with a country who deny a visa to anyone who has visited Israel?


Ooh dear has someone been denied a chance to do a few chats about 22 overpaid thugs kicking a ball about a bit in '22?? :question:

A sad loss to the airshow world, that may result in another first rate team on the circuit. And whos' to say the Croatians can't rebuild a team with what's left.... :joystick:
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DanO1978
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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by DanO1978 »

Not at all, and besides I don't have an Israeli stamp in my passport. Been to Qatar several years ago, stayed in six-star luxury overlooking the Arabian Gulf, and lived like a king. Had the suite next to Rafa Nadal, as it happens.

Worrying that so many of you seem not to give a care about Qatar's stance on Israel. That would probably change if you were given the chance of a choice between the Wings Of Avarice and an Israeli Ra'am...

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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by Chrisse »

DanO1978 wrote:
Worrying that so many of you seem not to give a care about Qatar's stance on Israel. That would probably change if you were given the chance of a choice between the Wings Of Avarice and an Israeli Ra'am...


Again, same with Pakistan, Kuwait and the Saudis. Did you refuse to commentate then, or do you find yourself worrying too?

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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by DanO1978 »

They brought their own.

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Chrisse
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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by Chrisse »

No, you brought politics into it, your argument was not about "buying their own". Your problem is with the visa-policy or did you forget already?
DanO1978 wrote:I take it you're OK with a country who deny a visa to anyone who has visited Israel?


DanO1978 wrote:...
Worrying that so many of you seem not to give a care about Qatar's stance on Israel. ...

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st24
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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by st24 »

DanO1978 wrote:Not at all, and besides I don't have an Israeli stamp in my passport. Been to Qatar several years ago, stayed in six-star luxury overlooking the Arabian Gulf, and lived like a king. Had the suite next to Rafa Nadal, as it happens.


Completely irrelevant to the conversation and it sounds like you were as royally treated as you were by RIAT.. I can't think of a worse place on the planet I'd rather be than next to a sports "personality" in a false hotel in an equally false, man made environment. But that's just little old humble me..

DanO1978 wrote:Worrying that so many of you seem not to give a care about Qatar's stance on Israel. That would probably change if you were given the chance of a choice between the Wings Of Avarice and an Israeli Ra'am...


So now you worry for us eh Dan, you're a trooper, you really are. :king: Let's face it, ANY Arabian nations stance to Isreal has been pretty poor over the years eh, and also some European ones too. And if I wanted to support avarice I'd just buy a football season ticket, Sky subscription or a Daily Mail.

I've already seen Ra'ams so yes, something different please! :up:
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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by boff180 »

End of the day the UK government tell the airshows which countries they can and cannot invite.

If the UK government is happy to allow them to appear then quite frankly I'm happy for them to attend.

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Petedcollins
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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by Petedcollins »

DanO1978 wrote:
Pablo wrote:
DanO1978 wrote:
BossMann wrote:Wow!

Wings of storm re-incarnated as the Qatari Air Force Aerobatic team - never heard of such a thing before.

Anyways, the croatians never managed to make it to the UK due to financial problems in Croatia, maybe we will get to see them in the UK in Qatari colours?


I would hope British airshows wouldn't be seen to be pandering to Qatar by booking them.


So British airshows should, in effect, take a political stance and disregard a brand new team from a pretty exotic air arm equipped with a type we've never before seen displayed in formation here, should they? Hmm...

A great shame to lose Wings of Storm - among the best teams (turboprop or otherwise) I've ever seen - but good luck to the pilots...


I take it you're OK with a country who deny a visa to anyone who has visited Israel?


Actually perfectly fine with it

It has nothing to do with airshows or showcasing pilot skill and technique, anytime we let a countries own internal politics interfere with airshows then we should have politicians running the show

Anything outside of this is none of our concern and should have no impact on who is invited to any show in the UK

DanO1978
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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by DanO1978 »

"None of our concern".

That sort of attitude just about sums up the world's apathy right now, and why oppressive regimes are allowed to flourish.

It also speaks volumes for the current state of, and quality of UKAR.

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CJS
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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by CJS »

None taken :smile:

Perhaps none of 'my' concern might have been a better way for the poster to put it but that was a bit of a strong comeback Dan (IMHO of course).

We don't all share the same viewpoint :shock: the world would be a dull place (although admittedly slightler friendlier) if we did. (For the record, I agree with (most of) what you are saying in this instance).

I am sure no-one would want to belittle the importance of anything going on anywhere in the hugely complex malestrom of world politics, and are just keen to seperate airshows from anything, well not striclty airshow related.

However as Andy points out - and he generally speaks much sense - who is invited to an airshow is influenced by world goings on because governments dictate who can be invited and who not.

To have a general UKAR-bash just seems a bit nonsensical (although of course you're entitled to do so as you wish :smile: )

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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by Brevet Cable »

Hang on a sec.....

Image

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Ray Purchase
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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by Ray Purchase »

Is this thread real, or some sort of early April fool joke?
Tragic.
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jon93
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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by jon93 »

There's thread drifting and then there's this, I'm quite impressed at how off topic this has gone, in the space of just two pages as well. :clap:

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Exiler
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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by Exiler »

DanO1978 wrote:It also speaks volumes for the current state of, and quality of UKAR.


No one is forcing you to stay are they?

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CJS
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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by CJS »

jon93 wrote:There's thread drifting and then there's this, I'm quite impressed at how off topic this has gone, in the space of just two pages as well. :clap:


Threads drift, it's called having a discussion ;-)
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Ray Purchase
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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by Ray Purchase »

Chris Strawson wrote:
jon93 wrote:There's thread drifting and then there's this, I'm quite impressed at how off topic this has gone, in the space of just two pages as well. :clap:


Threads drift, it's called having a discussion ;-)


Course it is.
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CJS
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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by CJS »

Well anywhere normal it would be :-D ;-)
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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by sylvancatharsis »

DanO1978 wrote:I take it you're OK with a country who deny a visa to anyone who has visited Israel?

Screw that, under Qatari law atheism and apostasy from Islam are punishable by death.

We can talk about air shows being apolitical if we're talking about civilians. I realize that not even Denmark has a spotless human rights record, but I don't want the armed representative of a government that executes people for what they think at my air show.
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st24
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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by st24 »

sylvancatharsis wrote:
DanO1978 wrote:I take it you're OK with a country who deny a visa to anyone who has visited Israel?

Screw that, under Qatari law atheism and apostasy from Islam are punishable by death.

We can talk about air shows being apolitical if we're talking about civilians. I realize that not even Denmark has a spotless human rights record, but I don't want the armed representative of a government that executes people for what they think at my air show.


So you're not going to RIAT this year then?...
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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by Chrisse »

sylvancatharsis wrote:
DanO1978 wrote:I take it you're OK with a country who deny a visa to anyone who has visited Israel?

Screw that, under Qatari law atheism and apostasy from Islam are punishable by death.

We can talk about air shows being apolitical if we're talking about civilians. I realize that not even Denmark has a spotless human rights record, but I don't want the armed representative of a government that executes people for what they think at my air show.


According to Saudi law, atheism is an act of terrorism. Will you be deleting the pictures you made of the Saudi Hawks in an act of protest? Should the Saudis decide to send an F-15 or Tornado for static display, you will walk away in disgust and not go anywhere near the show? Perhaps we should call this place the UK Airshow Righteous :grin:

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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by benji1867 »

THIS.IS.BRILLIANT

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Re: Croatian Wings of Storm no more

Post by Wes_Howes »

benji1867 wrote:THIS.IS.BRILLIANT


Image