Jaguar Nightshoot

[AndyXH558]

Thank you Howard, Its great that the museum development is still going ahead.

I hope kieron doesnt mind but if we can get 10 to 15 people for a night shoot at Solway aircraft Museum They may be able to do one, As i have siad before the Vulcan has had a repaint and looks amazing, also the Canberra WE188 in her suez colours too, They have a phantom, lightning, hunter , meteor and a Jet provost too all in amazing condition. They are extremely accommodating with what you require. so this is to see how many would be interested.

would be around £15 for the night shoot if there is enough interest.

[AndyXH558]

There is a full moon in october and one in may on a saturday night. this would be better for the solway shoot.

[cg_341]

The one in May is less than an hour after sunset though, Andy :/

[HeyfordDave111]

Me too for the Solway Vulcan.

[AndyXH558]

looks like its october then .... will have a word with the guys see what they say. Richard (vulcan558) do you fancy it too.

[Hammy]

unless you're prepared to start organising them or creating the opportunity yourself of course.

Yep, done that, with proper lighting, and not for £60+! As I said, we're charging £40 this time - 10 aircraft, lots from off-site, so we need to cover fuel costs.

Oh, and no, we don't run it for a profit. Amazing, eh?

Still more than most airshows

I was going to say something about the amount of people that attend airshows and how that figure might affect ticket prices when compared to a night-shoot, but it's so obvious I can't be bothered.

[AndyXH558]

Martin you've done these as long as i have. Wouldn't mind your options.

[hmeasures]

unless you're prepared to start organising them or creating the opportunity yourself of course.

Yep, done that, with proper lighting, and not for £60+! As I said, we're charging £40 this time - 10 aircraft, lots from off-site, so we need to cover fuel costs.

Oh, and no, we don't run it for a profit. Amazing, eh?

Still more than most airshows

I was going to say something about the amount of people that attend airshows and how that figure might affect ticket prices when compared to a night-shoot, but it's so obvious I can't be bothered.

If you cared to read my earlier post then you'd see that I understand that, and in fact have nothing against it. I do not mind paying a premium for decent opportunities, however I was merely pointing out to Chris that making a snide comment about organising a £40 nightshoot is.... well not exactly a great deal cheaper than the £48 halifax shoot, for example Was trying not to get drawn back into this but there we go.

[Slappywag]

unless you're prepared to start organising them or creating the opportunity yourself of course.

Yep, done that, with proper lighting, and not for £60+! As I said, we're charging £40 this time - 10 aircraft, lots from off-site, so we need to cover fuel costs.

Oh, and no, we don't run it for a profit. Amazing, eh?

Still more than most airshows

I was going to say something about the amount of people that attend airshows and how that figure might affect ticket prices when compared to a night-shoot, but it's so obvious I can't be bothered.

If you cared to read my earlier post then you'd see that I understand that, and in fact have nothing against it. I do not mind paying a premium for decent opportunities, however I was merely pointing out to Chris that making a snide comment about organising a £40 nightshoot is.... well not exactly a great deal cheaper than the £48 halifax shoot, for example Was trying not to get drawn back into this but there we go.

£48 however, for a single aircraft. And I think 'aircraft' can be used very loosely given what percentage is original Halifax.

[hmeasures]

unless you're prepared to start organising them or creating the opportunity yourself of course.

Yep, done that, with proper lighting, and not for £60+! As I said, we're charging £40 this time - 10 aircraft, lots from off-site, so we need to cover fuel costs.

Oh, and no, we don't run it for a profit. Amazing, eh?

Still more than most airshows

I was going to say something about the amount of people that attend airshows and how that figure might affect ticket prices when compared to a night-shoot, but it's so obvious I can't be bothered.

If you cared to read my earlier post then you'd see that I understand that, and in fact have nothing against it. I do not mind paying a premium for decent opportunities, however I was merely pointing out to Chris that making a snide comment about organising a £40 nightshoot is.... well not exactly a great deal cheaper than the £48 halifax shoot, for example Was trying not to get drawn back into this but there we go.

£48 however, for a single aircraft. And I think 'aircraft' can be used very loosely given what percentage is original Halifax.

[cg_341]

Two of the aircraft need around £200 of fuel each, we've also offered a donation for the HAF, plus six hotel rooms, we're already talking around a grand there. Another £500 or so for the lights, plus whatever costs have yet to be determined for another couple of possible visitors for the event. Oh, and fuel for our own aircraft. We've calculated it to be little over £2k for the night. From that, ticket sales minus Eventbrite fees, we're making a "profit" of £27.12, assuming we sell every last ticket.

So, does that explain why we're charging such a price? Oh, by the way, it's less than a fiver per aircraft

Again, I make the point that if people are willing to pay £48 for the Halifax, then it's clearly not too expensive, but for me, it is more than I would pay.

[Slappywag]

Two of the aircraft need around £200 of fuel each, we've also offered a donation for the HAF, plus six hotel rooms, we're already talking around a grand there. Another £500 or so for the lights, plus whatever costs have yet to be determined for another couple of possible visitors for the event. Oh, and fuel for our own aircraft. We've calculated it to be little over £2k for the night. From that, ticket sales minus Eventbrite fees, we're making a "profit" of £27.12, assuming we sell every last ticket.

So, does that explain why we're charging such a price? Oh, by the way, it's less than a fiver per aircraft

Again, I make the point that if people are willing to pay £48 for the Halifax, then it's clearly not too expensive, but for me, it is more than I would pay.

Nope. You're wrong. We've been told we are.

Fancy a game of tiddlywinks instead? (No idea of the relevance why specifically that.)

[hmeasures]

Two of the aircraft need around £200 of fuel each, we've also offered a donation for the HAF, plus six hotel rooms, we're already talking around a grand there. Another £500 or so for the lights, plus whatever costs have yet to be determined for another couple of possible visitors for the event. Oh, and fuel for our own aircraft. We've calculated it to be little over £2k for the night. From that, ticket sales minus Eventbrite fees, we're making a "profit" of £27.12, assuming we sell every last ticket.

So, does that explain why we're charging such a price? Oh, by the way, it's less than a fiver per aircraft

Again, I make the point that if people are willing to pay £48 for the Halifax, then it's clearly not too expensive, but for me, it is more than I would pay.

I was never questioning why you charge such a price...!

[NAM Updater]

Thank you Howard, Its great that the museum development is still going ahead.

Mini-victory to report - according to museum Twitter feed the 'Night Shoot Lights' passed their PAT test this week!!

[Traveller]

All those years you had chance to be at the fence by Coltishall
at night
for free
for flying shots.........................

[Talldan76]

I've been reading this post since it started, and have a different take on some of the points.

I think what people are missing is that TLE are a business - they have all of the normal overheads that come from running a business, they have to pay the owners / museums / operators / "re-enactors" and at the end of the day they are there to make a profit. If they didn't have to pay for all of those then the price may well be a little lower.

I have been to one of their events, (at Hangar 11 where they had the P-40 and the Spitfire) and it was a well organised event. Yes it was a little pricey, but the access we got to the 2 airframes was a lot closer and more intimate than a lot of other shoots. (the only gripe I would have was that the Re-Enactors were a little too "old" to be fully accurate).

People moan about the cost of the events, but no-one is holding a gun to your head saying that YOU have to attend, and that YOU have to pay.

Would I go to another one of their events, Yes, when I get the oppurtunity (and the OK from SWMBO - lol).

[Stagger2]

All those years you had chance to be at the fence by Coltishall
at night
for free
for flying shots........

Fair comment!...but some of the guys attending this event couldn't get the afternoon off from Primary School to get to Jagtown Scottow! I'm guilty as hell in denying my advancing years & not recognising all the brilliant 'never to be repeated' opportunities we had, or more regrettably wasted!
Now, remind me. Why didn't I go to Upper Heyford more than I did?
PS:- Spot-on Talldan 76...except the SWMBO bit!

[AndyXH558]

I only attended one of his events. I wasnt happy with the lighting or the reenactors
. Especially the strange bit where a guy turned up in full usaaf outfit. for a raf themed shoot. No one knew who he was but he would have looked amazing next to hangar 11s mustang.

The only good pics i got was of the dakota, the mossie was only half lit.. The Halifax was so badly lit I gave up. The Devon well I had lost interest by then
And im at a photo shoot not a football match so I don't need to take pictures by the sound of a whistle.

So many people using flash it was ridiculous. Previous shoots that were not his they just asked to warn people if they were. Nope it was a free for all.

Well night shoots are not me...


Good news by the way Howard. Hope that you get something sorted.. Now will we see the master of orange disguises Mr Hibbert..

There is one aircraft in itching to take a picture of but right now she's under wraps quite literally..

[King Cobra]

Only five tickets now.

I think this extract from the organisers web site should put the detractors minds at rest.

"All profits from this event are going to the RAF Benevolent Fund."

Cover Nick's costs and the rest goes to charity, seems fair to me.

All depends on what the organiser defines as "costs."

[King Cobra]

Stagger I agree, but however. Most museums i have taken pics at night have had their own lighting and in one case we used no light
For instance
vulcan night shot by andrew abbott, on Flickr

All we used was moonlight and a long exposure.

The apparatus used for a nightshoot does not cost very much, And yes i could run one of my own, I have a generator and get hold of the lights.

Lovely shoot. Really moody.

[sidmouth]

Good morning all

this thread was shared by a friend and I've followed with interest

my expertise is in railway themed events where in the main the price range is £50-£70 for a day event based on 30-40 photographers to cover the host railways costs amongst a number of participants that is comfortable to manage and allows everyone the opportunity and space to get the images they would like. I also try to have minimal costs which may mean I rely on free social media, e-mail groups, and payment in old fashioned ways but it leaves me at least with minimal risk

I don't make anything from running the events and do it as I enjoy doing so and my way of giving something back to railway preservation

Ultimately the market will decide . I suspect there is a limited pool of people but as long as there are enough to cover the costs then the events will run and the organiser motivated to do more

[ndcave]

Look at Northolt. Usually £20 - £ 30.

I'm amazed he's back at Wellesbourne. From what someone told me who was there, I thought he wasn't welcome back..

I did go to one of his events and was very disappointed and gave him constructive criticism.. He sent me a message back saying. Perhaps night shoots aren't for me.

Definitely not.. Well I've only been doing them since 2007. So no they aren't for me

See the problem with you Andy is you don't like to check the facts - there have been no issues at Wellesbourne and the only reason our next event isn't happen until October 2017 is a simple case of no room in our diaries. TimeLine Events raises £1000's for heritage and charities each year, last year the total figure was well over £100,000.

Yes I did comment that perhaps night shoots weren't for you in my reply to you, post the first Halifax shoot we did, but what you never seem mention on these forums is all the other positive comments I sent you in response to your initial email. I will post a transcript on here a bit later so that people can make there own minds up.

I have been running photo shoots since the 1990's and as TimeLine Events for around 4 years, I do not hide the fact this is a business and as a business has to make money to cover costs and hopefully make a profit but we have never cancelled an event due to a lack of funds, some run at break even and some even at a small loss so please do not think it's all about the profit.

For the record the price of the jaguar night shoot was set by the RAF and hasn't put over 100 people off, this shoot alone will raise over £5000 for the RAFBF.

[AndyXH558]

hi they have given the go ahead in principal. just waiting to get the final word on may be able to help with getting you to the museum from the station.

This is what Kieron has sent. hope you dont mind about this.

We have a provisional date, just going to firm it up in the next couple of days, but Saturday 15th October is looking the favourite. Sunset at 1812, moonrise at 1817 (full moon). I will arrange for the Vulcan to be cleared of all signs, covers, barriers etc., so if the sun is out and anyone wants to arrive early, clean daytime shots will be available as well. If we can get at least 15 people, who are willing to pay £20 in advance, then this will also entitle you to museum membership and entrance (£15 is the fee), and this will allow you to visit the museum as many times as you wish over 12 months. We are currently working on a quarterly newsletter regarding the museum and maybe Carlisle airport movements, and this will be sent to all members via email as part of the membership. I will need to get the Whirlwind cleaned up (bird droppings !) so that WV198 will be available, which is next to the Phantom. The Meteor is also in very good condition and as far as I can remember, we have not lit that up yet for a nightshoot.
Over to you to drum up some interest, and I will let you know within the next few days regarding the go-ahead. At that point then we can start a new thread - Solway Nightshoot. Let me know about the date though, is this suitable ?


All the money will go to the museum. I will not take a penny.

[AndyXH558]

more the merrier. we did cheat with the lights. we put a torch in the cockpit and led lights in the landing strobes but as you saw it works.

[Big_Gareth]

Just wanted to say that last night's Jaguar shoot was excellent, well worth the entry price and I would happily pay to do the event again.

Many thanks to Neil, the Cosford crew and anyone ele that made this opportunity available.

With £5000 raised for the RAF Benevolent Fund, I think the original complaining and moaning about the price was unnecessary and I for one, can't wait for future events to be held there