Where has XH558 thread gone?

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Reds Rolling
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by Reds Rolling »

vulcan558 wrote:It will also show the so called vtts defenders that seem to jump on any comment, actually no sweet F.A.
And there credibility on this subject is worth nothing.

If you're going to pull people up on their credibility, it's better that you know how to use the correct spelling first, or 'yule' end up looking a bit of a Image. :biggrin:

F-5F
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by F-5F »

Love visiting this site for spelling lessons! :dunno:

Xm657
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by Xm657 »

The VTTS defenders seem to have very little defence other than posting smileys, pointing out spelling mistakes or otherwise belittling anyone who dares to criticize the strategy or use of donated funds. The defence seems to be: "we know what we are doing despite what has happened in the last few years, besides she's our Vulcan and nothing else can be done but follow our plans. Now shut up and give us your money!!" They and the VTTS do themselves no favours, but then again, they still enjoy a steady flow of income so why should they care or change.
Last edited by Xm657 on Sun 08 Jul 2018, 5:19 pm, edited 2 times in total.

vbombers2
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by vbombers2 »

I noticed that there was no VTTS merchandise stand at Yeovilton this year, that's a first since 2008?

Xm657
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by Xm657 »

vbombers2 wrote:I noticed that there was no VTTS merchandise stand at Yeovilton this year, that's a first since 2008?


It may have reached a point where the cost of the pitch outweighs the sales revenue. The couple of stands I have seen this year certainly looked very quiet sales wise.

XP282
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by XP282 »

Reds Rolling wrote:
vulcan558 wrote:It will also show the so called vtts defenders that seem to jump on any comment, actually no sweet F.A.
And there credibility on this subject is worth nothing.

If you're going to pull people up on their credibility, it's better that you know how to use the correct spelling first, or 'yule' end up looking a bit of a Image. :biggrin:


No you don’t... your ability to spell is reflection on the quality of the argument you make on the credibility that you have.

Xm657
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by Xm657 »

XP282 wrote:
Reds Rolling wrote:
vulcan558 wrote:It will also show the so called vtts defenders that seem to jump on any comment, actually no sweet F.A.
And there credibility on this subject is worth nothing.

If you're going to pull people up on their credibility, it's better that you know how to use the correct spelling first, or 'yule' end up looking a bit of a Image. :biggrin:


No you don’t... your ability to spell is reflection on the quality of the argument you make on the credibility that you have.


So only people with impeccable spelling are in a credible position to criticize the VTTS? I don't agree. I would expect the VTTS officials to be able to spell, but their supporters are members of the public, "the people" who have given their money and hoped for a better outcome than this. If the "public" cannot spell it doesn't mean they can be disregarded and ignored, their views are valid and criticism obvious for all to see.

The retort of RR above gives away the elitist view of the VTTS and ivory tower they sit in: looking down on the people who have funded them.

IgnatiusJReilly
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by IgnatiusJReilly »

I have little expectation that VTTS will actually respond to any of the questions asked, but it's worth noting that the last update on the trusts progress, aside from the Press releases trumpeting the granting of planning permission, was last September. As we sit here in July, that's really not far off a year ago now.
That we are having to fight to have even basic operational questions answered is an absolute disgrace.

For a publicly funded charity, that is absolutely unconscionable.

I've argued before that whatever Dr Bob is doing, his decisions have to be taken with the support of the trustees.
You really have to ask are they trustees in name only and are they actually performing any of the duties and obligations required of them?
Eccentric, idealistic, and creative, sometimes to the point of delusion..

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MicrolightDriver
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by MicrolightDriver »

vulcan558 wrote:
bernarde wrote:
ExVulcanGC wrote:Beside these un-answered questions:

1. As of this morning, how many people are employed by VTST (or whatever they're called now)?
2. How many of those are full-time, part-time, freelance or on retainers?
3. How many contractors and consultants are currently being used by VTST?
4. If there are contractors/consultants on-board, are any of them directly linked to current/former VTST staff or their families?

I think there are a few more that would be of interest to a lot of people:

1. Have the runs to date proved profitable after costs and wages (for those that still get paid) have been removed?
2. Have the sales of spares and goods proved profitable after costs and wages (for those that still get paid) have been removed?
3. From the profits, if any, how much money is now is available to help house and build a valuable future for XH558?

4. What money is coming in for returning the Canberra to the sky and how much is left in the existing pot, to achieve that aim, if there is still money around for this project how is it being used and who will do the work and where?
5. What is happening to the Swift, is there any financial responsibilities for VTST, if so where is the money coming from and how is it being used?


Great questions which will fall on deaf and unwilling ears sadly.



It will also show the so called vtts defenders that seem to jump on any comment, actually no sweet F.A.
And there credibility on this subject is worth nothing.


Will it? Why?

Why does being challenged annoy you so much? This is a discussion forum isn't it??? - you certainly feel free to express your opinions!

Seems to me that 'so called defenders' tend to ask how you 'know' things? How you're so sure of what you're stating to be fact? when often it appears there's a contrary view out there. If you had the facts of what you're saying it would be easy to defend the statements you've made.

People sit around here accusing VTTS over one issue or another, but actually, doesn't that list of questions ( which nobody can answer) just expose the fact that most of what's aimed at VTTS is really just guesswork?

F-5F
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by F-5F »

MicrolightDriver wrote:
vulcan558 wrote:
bernarde wrote:
ExVulcanGC wrote:Beside these un-answered questions:

1. As of this morning, how many people are employed by VTST (or whatever they're called now)?
2. How many of those are full-time, part-time, freelance or on retainers?
3. How many contractors and consultants are currently being used by VTST?
4. If there are contractors/consultants on-board, are any of them directly linked to current/former VTST staff or their families?

I think there are a few more that would be of interest to a lot of people:

1. Have the runs to date proved profitable after costs and wages (for those that still get paid) have been removed?
2. Have the sales of spares and goods proved profitable after costs and wages (for those that still get paid) have been removed?
3. From the profits, if any, how much money is now is available to help house and build a valuable future for XH558?

4. What money is coming in for returning the Canberra to the sky and how much is left in the existing pot, to achieve that aim, if there is still money around for this project how is it being used and who will do the work and where?
5. What is happening to the Swift, is there any financial responsibilities for VTST, if so where is the money coming from and how is it being used?


Great questions which will fall on deaf and unwilling ears sadly.



It will also show the so called vtts defenders that seem to jump on any comment, actually no sweet F.A.
And there credibility on this subject is worth nothing.


Will it? Why?

Why does being challenged annoy you so much? This is a discussion forum isn't it??? - you certainly feel free to express your opinions!

Seems to me that 'so called defenders' tend to ask how you 'know' things? How you're so sure of what you're stating to be fact? when often it appears there's a contrary view out there. If you had the facts of what you're saying it would be easy to defend the statements you've made.

People sit around here accusing VTTS over one issue or another, but actually, doesn't that list of questions ( which nobody can answer) just expose the fact that most of what's aimed at VTTS is really just guesswork?


Exactly. We don't know anything because there probably isn't anything to know!! :lmao:

Problem is VTTS don't want us to know that there isn't anything to know as the game would then be over!! :lmao:

ExVulcanGC
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by ExVulcanGC »

People sit around here accusing VTTS over one issue or another, but actually, doesn't that list of questions ( which nobody can answer) just expose the fact that most of what's aimed at VTTS is really just guesswork?



My bold, so you are saying that there is no one within VTST who knows anything about how much money they are making, what is bringing in that money, what that money is being used for, or what is happening to the three aircraft in their care, that is quite worrying if people are still giving them lots of money and it is disappearing to god knows where.

I also believe the 'people' have a right to know where their money is going and asking valid questions is not accusing them of anything, any business, and especially a charity, should have answer available to all those questions, and any others that the people who support them ask, if they don't, then some of the 'accusations' could be considered valid.

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MicrolightDriver
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by MicrolightDriver »

ExVulcanGC wrote:
People sit around here accusing VTTS over one issue or another, but actually, doesn't that list of questions ( which nobody can answer) just expose the fact that most of what's aimed at VTTS is really just guesswork?



My bold, so you are saying that there is no one within VTST who knows anything about how much money they are making, what is bringing in that money, what that money is being used for, or what is happening to the three aircraft in their care, that is quite worrying if people are still giving them lots of money and it is disappearing to god knows where.

I also believe the 'people' have a right to know where their money is going and asking valid questions is not accusing them of anything, any business, and especially a charity, should have answer available to all those questions, and any others that the people who support them ask, if they don't, then some of the 'accusations' could be considered valid.


My apologies, I should have been clearer - when I said 'nobody' can answer, I was writing in the context of my sentence, and the people who 'sit around here accusing VTTS'.

Nothing wrong with asking questions at all ( the very point I was raising with vulcan558 ) but in needing to ask some of those listed questions, it's really highlighted that many of the accusations thrown at VTTS ( and there are many! ) are clearly just based on assumption and guesswork rather than known fact.

vulcan558
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by vulcan558 »

The point is we have seen a list of simple questions go up. That to be honest anyone in or around the vtts team could or should be able to answer in a drop of a hat.
But we are here 3 or 4 days later with not 1 of those questions getting an answer. So it looks like nobody is doing anything or nobody knows what anyone is doing.
We now have about 3 pages of the normal clap trap diversion from the questions.
The normal way most get out of things buy pulling the
Spelling and grammer card out.
Last edited by vulcan558 on Mon 09 Jul 2018, 5:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Xm657
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by Xm657 »

F-5F wrote:Problem is VTTS don't want us to know that there isn't anything to know as the game would then be over!! :lmao:


You've hit the nail on the head there. The deafening silence is the only way they can survive. If they actually came clean and said Doncaster had been a total disappointment, and building a hangar is far harder than they thought, people might just give up now. There will reach a point though, possibly this year, where even the blindest of their followers will start wondering where the money is going and why there is nothing to show for it. The problem then, will be an awful lot more people that have been let down and given their money for nothing. The result: an even bigger mountain for someone to climb to secure 558's future, if indeed anyone comes forward to help by then.

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HeyfordDave111
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by HeyfordDave111 »

Not sure of the visible condition 558 is in now. Has anyone got an up to date photograph? However......

I'll let this still active link speak for itself.....

https://www.yorkshire.com/view/culture/ ... ce-1213732
Got to love Russianhardware

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sooty655
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by sooty655 »

HeyfordDave111 wrote:Not sure of the visible condition 558 is in now. Has anyone got an up to date photograph? However......

I'll let this still active link speak for itself.....

https://www.yorkshire.com/view/culture/ ... ce-1213732

I wonder if Reds Rolling has noticed the spelling of "Experiance". :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:

vulcan558
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by vulcan558 »

sooty655 wrote:
HeyfordDave111 wrote:Not sure of the visible condition 558 is in now. Has anyone got an up to date photograph? However......

I'll let this still active link speak for itself.....

https://www.yorkshire.com/view/culture/ ... ce-1213732

I wonder if Reds Rolling has noticed the spelling of "Experiance". :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:

I know im thick, but that takes the pee,

vulcan558
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by vulcan558 »

vulcan558 wrote:
sooty655 wrote:
HeyfordDave111 wrote:Not sure of the visible condition 558 is in now. Has anyone got an up to date photograph? However......

I'll let this still active link speak for itself.....

https://www.yorkshire.com/view/culture/ ... ce-1213732

I wonder if Reds Rolling has noticed the spelling of "Experiance". :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:

I know I'm thick, but that takes the pee,

reheat module
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by reheat module »

^^^^^^^^^
In that context, there is very little difference between 'experience' and 'expenses'...
Canon systems

GertrudetheMerciless
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by GertrudetheMerciless »

Xm657 wrote:
XP282 wrote:
No you don’t... your ability to spell is reflection on the quality of the argument you make on the credibility that you have.


So only people with impeccable spelling are in a credible position to criticize the VTTS?


Yse.

Obviously sometimes the point is lost that, in the event of this being a face-to-face discussion, spelling would be irreverent. :wink:

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MicrolightDriver
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by MicrolightDriver »

HeyfordDave111 wrote:Not sure of the visible condition 558 is in now. Has anyone got an up to date photograph?


There's a few on their website taken in June. I expect there'll be more after this upcoming weekend's EGRs.

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Dan O'Hagan
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by Dan O'Hagan »

Reds Rolling wrote:
vulcan558 wrote:It will also show the so called vtts defenders that seem to jump on any comment, actually no sweet F.A.
And there credibility on this subject is worth nothing.

If you're going to pull people up on their credibility, it's better that you know how to use the correct spelling first, or 'yule' end up looking a bit of a Image. :biggrin:


If, once the thing is Pepsi cans, one wished to look back at what the attitude of those who have sucked from the VTTS teat was towards the general public, this post from "Reds Rolling" ( :whistle: ) is a most fitting and apposite epitaph.

IgnatiusJReilly
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by IgnatiusJReilly »

Could somebody else check my calculations please?
Really rough estimations would suggest that approx 12,000 names were signed up to the recent 25th anniversary sticker appeal.
Using the same method, the previous 10th anniversary appeal attracted 5,000.


If that is true, I am staggered and thoroughly depressed.
No wonder VTTS aren't in any rush to provide progress updates or explain what they're doing, not now that their salaries are covered for the next year.
Even better is that the next set of Engine runs will ensure that the trustees' biscuit barrel can be amply replenished.
Sun's out, feet up, Wimbledon, football & tour de France and a perusal of the new edition of 'What Car'...
Money for nothing as the song goes.
Eccentric, idealistic, and creative, sometimes to the point of delusion..

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iainpeden
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by iainpeden »

My daughter told me she was going to pay to have my name inscribed/painted/stuck on the Vulcan as a Father's Day (maybe that should be Fathers' Day) but they had sold out of space- thank goodness she didn't waste her money.
(Mark Twain: There are lies, there are damn lies and then there are statistics)

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Dan O'Hagan
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Re: Where has XH558 thread gone?

Post by Dan O'Hagan »

IgnatiusJReilly wrote:Could somebody else check my calculations please?
Really rough estimations would suggest that approx 12,000 names were signed up to the recent 25th anniversary sticker appeal.
Using the same method, the previous 10th anniversary appeal attracted 5,000.


If that is true, I am staggered and thoroughly depressed.
No wonder VTTS aren't in any rush to provide progress updates or explain what they're doing, not now that their salaries are covered for the next year.
Even better is that the next set of Engine runs will ensure that the trustees' biscuit barrel can be amply replenished.
Sun's out, feet up, Wimbledon, football & tour de France and a perusal of the new edition of 'What Car'...
Money for nothing as the song goes.


Where did you get those figures from? Staggering that anyone of lucid mind would give them a penny, when there's not a shred of clear progress on the hangar in the public domain for years.

Still, they're probably too busy counting all that money to bother answering the questions asked in this thread the best part of a week ago.

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