Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

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hairrig
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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by hairrig »

andygolfer wrote:Throckmorton traffic management - my take on it


Good summary Andy!

Only thought is that the 'organisers' may have painted themselves into a corner by having the display line where it was. I presume they couldn't have cars queing on Throckmorton Road/ Long Lane under displaying aircraft. Obviously could have been open before the displays started though as long as it was shut again at 'Point D' in time to allow flying to start.

It was only closed by a few movable cones though - not sure if a formal road closure was in place. :whistle:

Andy


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capercaillie
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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by capercaillie »

clearstone wrote:http://www.worcesternews.co.uk/news/13319361._Ticketless_fans_were_to_blame_for_Throckmorton_Airshow_traffic_chaos_/


Interesting because everyone entering around the time I did was going through the tickets entry point. I saw nobody entering via the cash only entry point???????????

An excuse? As has been pointed out, one entry point was being used for cars, one lane in. It was inadequate.
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paullangford
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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by paullangford »

clearstone wrote:http://www.worcesternews.co.uk/news/13319361._Ticketless_fans_were_to_blame_for_Throckmorton_Airshow_traffic_chaos_/


Oh Dear....the backlash on FB will be immense after reading that..........& they may have just lost that airshow I feel.

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WG655
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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by WG655 »

Certainly defeats the point of an 'advance ticket only' event if drivers were admitted simply due to being in the queue, and this is something not helped by the pictures taken of 'cash only' points being open to take the money of people buying on the day.

A lot of work will be needed to entice people back, whilst ensuring the chaos that seemed to have occurred does not happen again. There's an awful lot of backlash indeed; not helped by an official statement released 48 hours after the event itself which skirts around some of the key issues that people have raised.

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Wissam24
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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by Wissam24 »

The social media reaction and the reviews here make for grim reading. It sounds like if they want to host an airshow again in the future there is a hell of a lot of accountability that needs to be dealt with.
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stuart n
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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by stuart n »

A similar backlash happened after Air Fete 2001 and look what happened to that show....

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paullangford
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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by paullangford »

The cynic in me feels that that was a carefully scripted FB post that a legal team have looked over...........allegedly :whistle:

Hopefully it won't spoil it for other events and set a precedent, if you buy an online ticket, can't get in due to bad organisation, and then can't get a refund..

I hope that doesn't happen, I think the organisers are genuine people, but the situation overwhelmed them, they couldn't cope, and didn't have a plan B.
I think they should offer some sort of olive branch to the hundreds/ thousands that bought an online ticket, and couldn't get in.

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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by andygolfer »

clearstone wrote:http://www.worcesternews.co.uk/news/13319361._Ticketless_fans_were_to_blame_for_Throckmorton_Airshow_traffic_chaos_/


blaming numerous people without tickets is just trying to look for somebody to blame.
The number paying at the 'cash only' entrance was minimal, when I went in (via the ticket only entrance') there was one person paying cash and when I came out there was a father and his son paying cash, no queue or anything. They were obviously expecting people to pay on the gate as they had people assigned to man it and it had a big professional well printed sign saying 'cash only' so it wasn't a last minute panic by the organisers - it was planned!

I think if I hadn't had an advance ticket I would probably have turned round and gone home long before I reached the gate but in fact there weren't numerous cars turning back so I assume most ticketless people made it to the show but by the look of that 'cash only' gate there were actually very few without tickets.
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Tommy
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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by Tommy »

I went to Cosford in '09 and '13 which, traffic-wise, were probably the two worst years Cosford had seen recently. I also attended the Duxford show last year where the two Lancs attended, and numerous other shows with either terrific weather or terrific items, or both, but I've never seen traffic as bad as the traffic I saw on the weekend.

Perhaps it was down to the Vulcan, but even so, other small shows manage it, and there wasn't really any other standout "star" items for families (Blenheim, perhaps, but that might be leaning more to wards attracting enthusiasts).

The traffic really was poorly managed. I never condone social media abuse (of which there was a LOT), but the substance of the complaints wasn't without merit, and the organisers really do need to have a look at next year's traffic management. It'll be a difficult sell for next year's show going on this year's experience.

It's pretty cheap ( :whistle: ) to blame those without tickets. There were no signs up near the show saying advanced tickets only, and ticketless families should have only been a factor in the morning. There should have been no families without tickets trying to leave the show in the evening, and the traffic was just as poorly managed then as it was earlier on. It doesn't wash to blame it all on ticketless attendees.

The press-release also notes a failure of any plan to deal with those without tickets attempting to turn up, which shows remarkable lack of foresight.

I'm not sure how the organisers could refund those who didn't get in. Not to say they aren't deserving, but I don't think there's anything to stop everyone claiming they didn't get in.

It's done now, though. The organisers should properly assess the failings of this year's show, and I wish them all the best in resolving them for next year.

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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by Tim Spouge »

The traffic problem started right at the beginning of the day. I arrived at the main site gates around 8.30am. There were about 15-20 cars in front of the site gates which were closed. This small plot in front of the gates was being used as a holding area for cars, and filled up in minutes. Unfortunately there were HGVs trying to get into and out of the site but couldn't due to the cars queueing up. An irate farmer came out with his dogs and said that his tractors and trailers will be coming this way soon and pointed to the damage they had done to the fence - he started having a go at us drivers but there was nothing we could do!

When they decided to open the site gates around 9am because the roads were blocked, we moved down towards the car park. However we waited another 20 minutes or so while a group of 20 cadets had a briefing meeting in the car park, before we were allowed in, at which point only one person knew what they were doing! All they needed to do was have the car park open early to avoid the backlog and I'm sure those poor people queuing to get in all morning would have had a better journey. As I walked to the site entrance I was puzzled to see the empty cash only entrance after all the advance ticket only warnings.

I decided to leave half an hour after the Vulcan since the GWDT confirmed cancellation and there wasn't much left worth watching. Getting out was a total joke, 1 hour to do a couple of hundred yards! It seems that there was no exit strategy or personnel trying to control traffic. A few drivers were involved in prangs because they were not concentrating on what they were doing.

All I hope is that other venues take note of what happened at Throckmorton and make every effort to avoid a repeat. They need to open car parks early and have people controlling traffic on the way out.

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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by IgnatiusJReilly »

For me the takeaway message is that those organising any event that has the Vulcan booked, need to have a robust plan A, plan B & plan C tested and ready to go.
And I'll be working out a stupidly early departure time for the show's I'm planning to attend this summer. And then setoff 90mins earlier, still.

Unfortunately for Throckmorton, I think that'll be the end for this show.
Is a crying shame, and the punters would come back eventually, but I imagine every villager in the parish will be out to ensure there isn't another show..
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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by vulcan558 »

Selling a reported 20k tickets and the unbelievable think that opening gates at 10.00am was a stupid move,
say 2 people per car on average, would take a longbtime to get that many cars in and parked.
even getting 60 in a minute is unreal through 1 gate,
seems they had got the money and just lay back and had a lie in bed, the gates should have been open 8am at least.
Vulcan effect maybe, I hope Cosford will look at this, get them gates open early, or I can see bigger traffic chaos again this weekend at Cosford.

feel sorry for those people that pay for an event, the cost of time and petrol and money spent on food and picnic etc they take, only to sit in a traffic jam for 5 hrs and not get what they paid for.

They really needed to realise that getting 10k of cars through 1 gate at 60 cars per minute at best would be 600 cars per hour, even 1000 an hour you would never do it from 10am when show starts at 12.00.

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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by Tim Spouge »

Say 20,000 cars arriving over two hours is roughly one car every 3 seconds - they definitely needed to have the car park open early, several lanes in, and have a good plan on how to get cars parked quickly!

It was the same situation getting out, except it was probably something like 15,000 cars leaving in under an hour!

It may be the Vulcan effect and Throckmorton are likely to have much fewer visitors in future years.

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Lee606
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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by Lee606 »

She described people abandoning their cars everywhere - “in laybys, and by the side of the road” and saw an elderly man forced to “lift the bonnet of his car and urinate in the engine as there was nowhere private for him to go”.



Seriously...Who gets out of their car in traffic,lifts the bonnet and pisses all over the engine....

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maffie
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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by maffie »

Abingdon air fair has the right idea. Even though the gate to the airshow doesn't open until 10am, the car park is open earlier.

Get the cars in the car park and parked up. Everyone can then sit in their car and wait, or join the queue at the gate on foot until 10:00

I don't think it will be the end of Throckmorton (just look at Biggin Hill last year. They say 'they have learnt lessons' from the same type of car parking problems and it's going ahead Saturday).

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andygolfer
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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by andygolfer »

Lee606 wrote:She described people abandoning their cars everywhere - “in laybys, and by the side of the road” and saw an elderly man forced to “lift the bonnet of his car and urinate in the engine as there was nowhere private for him to go”.



Seriously...Who gets out of their car in traffic,lifts the bonnet and p**ses all over the engine....


Well ,it seems that one elderly gentleman did. I just hope that for his own safety he made sure the bonnet support was secured properly first otherwise it could have been very painful, I was going to say adding insult to injury but in reality I should phrase it 'adding injury to insult' :biggrin:
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CrowdlinePhotography
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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by CrowdlinePhotography »

A date has already been confirmed for next year suprisingly - 11th June

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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by spellow3010 »

andygolfer wrote:
Lee606 wrote:She described people abandoning their cars everywhere - “in laybys, and by the side of the road” and saw an elderly man forced to “lift the bonnet of his car and urinate in the engine as there was nowhere private for him to go”.



Seriously...Who gets out of their car in traffic,lifts the bonnet and p**ses all over the engine....


Well ,it seems that one elderly gentleman did. I just hope that for his own safety he made sure the bonnet support was secured properly first otherwise it could have been very painful, I was going to say adding insult to injury but in reality I should phrase it 'adding injury to insult' :biggrin:


Only needs one person to complain about the old man and he's committed a sexual offence. Modern times...

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Tommy
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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by Tommy »

Anyone buy a programme for this? I was struck that there was no display timetable in mine, which is one of the main points of buying a programme?

Perhaps I had an insert that fell out unnoticed or being blind or something, but if not, that's surely another blunder. Had to rely on Bacon's intermittent announcements...

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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by capercaillie »

Tommy wrote:Anyone buy a programme for this? I was struck that there was no display timetable in mine, which is one of the main points of buying a programme?

Perhaps I had an insert that fell out unnoticed or being blind or something, but if not, that's surely another blunder. Had to rely on Bacon's intermittent announcements...



I didn't, but looked at the chap's next to me and there was a paper insert with the running order although no times.
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andygolfer
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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by andygolfer »

I bought one and asked if it had the flying order in it and was told that the order in the programme was that planned at the time of printing but some of the items would be moved around as some were no shows due to the weather. No times were given but the order of those which flew was not that far out in the end. One that I remember was that the Vulcan had been planned for 2.30 but was moved back to 3pm

Andy
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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by Timc »

I didn't attend the show but would be interested to know the reasoning behind the advance ticket only policy, or not as the case maybe reading some of the comments?

Clearly it had nothing to do with traffic management, unlike Cosford this year!

Get the money in early to book display items possibly?

Only curious, and certainly not a direct dig at the organisers! :smile:

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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by TYPHOON3 »

Lee606 wrote:She described people abandoning their cars everywhere - “in laybys, and by the side of the road” and saw an elderly man forced to “lift the bonnet of his car and urinate in the engine as there was nowhere private for him to go”.



Seriously...Who gets out of their car in traffic,lifts the bonnet and pisses all over the engine....

I bet it stunk a bit as well urinating on a hot engine :sick:

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Re: Throckmorton Airshow 6th June 2015

Post by clearstone »

Timc wrote:I didn't attend the show but would be interested to know the reasoning behind the advance ticket only policy, or not as the case maybe reading some of the comments?

Clearly it had nothing to do with traffic management, unlike Cosford this year!

Get the money in early to book display items possibly?

Only curious, and certainly not a direct dig at the organisers! :smile:


Going by the direction of the airshow's Facebook which is fast becoming a textbook example of "what NOT to do" on social media, no-one will really ever know the answers unless the organisers have a change of heart.

Anyone remember the short-lived South East Airshow? - http://www.kentonline.co.uk/thanet/news ... kent-2332/