The UKAR politics thread

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vandal
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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by vandal »

I'm more concerned that Dominic Cummings has somehow managed to blag himself a visit to Hereford.

https://www.expressandstar.com/news/uk- ... ity-sites/

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rockfordstone
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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by rockfordstone »

vandal wrote:
Wed 08 Jul 2020, 7:37 pm
I'm more concerned that Dominic Cummings has somehow managed to blag himself a visit to Hereford.

https://www.expressandstar.com/news/uk- ... ity-sites/
it is rather concerning that an unelected, totally unaccountable SPAD who is in contempt of parliament is allowed to visit the most secure locations we have.

if we are concerned, image how furious bet the brexiters who wanted rid of that sort of thing must be

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Spiny Norman
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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by Spiny Norman »

Porton Down? Suppose it makes a change for him to travel to a place that has infectious diseases, rather than carrying them there himself...

You can't make this up: an unelected bureaucrat leading a government review. The very man who worked on a project to rid Britain of being run by unelected bureaucrats.

Britain in 2020 is a bit of a joke.

Zoom
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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by Zoom »

In case anyone still thinks Brexit was a good idea; and this is before we even contemplate how we are going to trade on WTO rules

British companies will face new barriers selling their products in the European Union, while UK nationals will face “thorough checks” when travelling to the continent even if there is a Brexit trade deal, the European commission has said.

In a document warning businesses to prepare for the end of the Brexit transition period, the EU executive said many changes were “inevitable” even if the two sides reached an agreement by the end of the year.

EU chief negotiator Michel Barnier released the document, after three days of talks with his counterpart David Frost in London, where he said “significant divergences” remained between the two sides.

The 35-page document contained a thinly-veiled criticism of the UK government’s decision not to opt for a one or two-year extension of the Brexit transition period.

The choices made by the United Kingdom’s government on the future relationship and on not extending the transition period mean that these inevitable disruptions will occur as of 1 January 2021 and risk compounding the pressure that businesses are already under due to the Covid-19 outbreak.

It also underscores that Brussels has no intention of phasing in border controls, an approach favoured by the British government. From 1 January 2021, customs officers in EU member states are expected to carry out full controls, which are “ likely to lead to increased administrative burdens for businesses and longer delivery times in logistical supply chains” the commission said. These controls will apply even if the EU and UK are successful in agreeing a trade deal that sets tariffs at zero, with no limits on quantities of exports and imports.

As Barnier has long trailed, British financial firms in the City of London will lose the “passports” that allow them to sell services in the rest of the union.

As well as losing their right to live, work and travel freely in the 27-country zone, British nationals will also face “thorough checks” at the border and cannot stay for more than 90 days in any 180-day period.

Travellers will no longer be assured protection under EU passenger rights law that guarantees some compensation, nor will they have sure access to reduced roaming rates, while cats, dogs and other domestic animals will be stripped of the EU pet passport

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LN Strike Eagle
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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by LN Strike Eagle »

Freedom!
"You really are an oafish philistine at times!"

Paulish
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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by Paulish »

LN Strike Eagle wrote:
Thu 09 Jul 2020, 6:15 pm
Freedom!
Is that freedom as in no longer being told what to do by unelected bureaucrats?

Domvickery
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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by Domvickery »

Paulish wrote:
Fri 10 Jul 2020, 7:17 am
LN Strike Eagle wrote:
Thu 09 Jul 2020, 6:15 pm
Freedom!
Is that freedom as in no longer being told what to do by unelected bureaucrats?
Like Dominic Cummings?

Free straws available to clutch at - PM me. Inventor of the baguette scale

vandal
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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by vandal »

Domvickery wrote:
Fri 10 Jul 2020, 7:22 am
Paulish wrote:
Fri 10 Jul 2020, 7:17 am
LN Strike Eagle wrote:
Thu 09 Jul 2020, 6:15 pm
Freedom!
Is that freedom as in no longer being told what to do by unelected bureaucrats?
Like Dominic Cummings?

Yet, around the time Mr Cummings presented Jackanory from the garden of No 10 not so long ago, didn't he say something about quitting, or at least considering it, but not for 6 Months?

If true, why the urgency to get tours round these sensitive areas?

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Tommy
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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by Tommy »



No-one, including my parents and some close friends, who voted for Brexit can yet tell me what they think they won.

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rockfordstone
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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by rockfordstone »

Tommy wrote:
Mon 13 Jul 2020, 11:34 am


No-one, including my parents and some close friends, who voted for Brexit can yet tell me what they think they won.
notice how the government are releasing details of hey they can stop foreigners coming into the country today.
its almost as if they are trying to hide the fact that "project fear" is actually just reality

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jasonT1981
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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by jasonT1981 »

5 years ago I never would have considered getting an Irish Passport even though I was born on the island, and lived my life in Northern Ireland.

Last week, after a 4 month wait it arrived. Can't lie, free movement through Europe as an EU citizen was the main reason. I joke with my friends and family I will meet them at the hotel and will be on my 4th drink by the pool by the time they get through customs.

verreli
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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by verreli »

jasonT1981 wrote:
Mon 13 Jul 2020, 6:40 pm
I joke with my friends and family I will meet them at the hotel and will be on my 4th drink by the pool by the time they get through customs.
... or more likely just wait for them on the transfer bus?

I got my new passport too. I've been hearing things about 'black passports matter' in the media or something. Well, the burgundy one is being semi-retired, to be used only when I need to send it away for a VISA. Things are changing. Resistance is futile.

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boff180
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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by boff180 »

The Government revealed the details of the new immigration system today.

Here's one little bit.

Care workers, except the most senior, will be excluded from being allowed to enter the UK.
The Government have said, they expect British citizens to undertake this role as they class it as "unskilled".

The care home association have now responded saying there are already thousands of vacancies in the sector and they have no choice but to recruit abroad because not enough people in the UK want to do the job. Plus that every representation saying that has been ignored by the Home Office.

Where the hell are all these magic willing workers going to come from?

I have a horrible feeling that because of the sh*t storm which is coming, we will see a law where jobless are ordered to do a job where there is a shortage - no matter their level of qualification or working sector. Totalitarian state here we come.

I am ashamed at the moment to say I am British, I'm even more ashamed to say I am English.

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Spiny Norman
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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by Spiny Norman »

boff180 wrote:
Mon 13 Jul 2020, 7:28 pm
The Government revealed the details of the new immigration system today.

Here's one little bit.

Care workers, except the most senior, will be excluded from being allowed to enter the UK.
The Government have said, they expect British citizens to undertake this role as they class it as "unskilled".

The care home association have now responded saying there are already thousands of vacancies in the sector and they have no choice but to recruit abroad because not enough people in the UK want to do the job. Plus that every representation saying that has been ignored by the Home Office.

Where the hell are all these magic willing workers going to come from?

I have a horrible feeling that because of the sh*t storm which is coming, we will see a law where jobless are ordered to do a job where there is a shortage - no matter their level of qualification or working sector. Totalitarian state here we come.

I am ashamed at the moment to say I am British, I'm even more ashamed to say I am English.
I'm amazed there's not more of an outrage about this. Care homes look after the nation's elderly. The elderly who are grannies, grandads, aunties, etc, of those who have a voice.

When there's less staff those in care homes don't get as well looked after. (Not that the current care about this aspect, judging by the Covid response).

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boff180
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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by boff180 »

There has been quite a bit of outrage from the Industry and from Labour.

The Home Office response reported on Sky News - it's only Labour trying to open the doors to unskilled immigrants again - that's what they want.

Idiots.

verreli
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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by verreli »

boff180 wrote:
Mon 13 Jul 2020, 7:28 pm
Where the hell are all these magic willing workers going to come from?
Care work is unskilled; I'd give it a go if it was a choice between that and claiming benefits. In a couple of months time furlough will end and a million plus low skilled shop assistants, restaurant staff, etc will enter the job market. The jobs they came from are highly unlikely to return. Covid-19 was the catalyst for a profound global economic change. Many will have to make some stark choices about how to pay the bills. I suggest they consider care work and get in early !

vandal
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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by vandal »

verreli wrote:
Mon 13 Jul 2020, 9:13 pm
boff180 wrote:
Mon 13 Jul 2020, 7:28 pm
Where the hell are all these magic willing workers going to come from?
Care work is unskilled; I'd give it a go if it was a choice between that and claiming benefits. In a couple of months time furlough will end and a million plus low skilled shop assistants, restaurant staff, etc will enter the job market. The jobs they came from are highly unlikely to return. Covid-19 was the catalyst for a profound global economic change. Many will have to make some stark choices about how to pay the bills. I suggest they consider care work and get in early !
What most may not know, is that, although care work is considered 'unskilled', one needs a PVG certificate (Scotland - England have their own equivelant) to be able to do this job.

PVG - Protecting Vulnerable Groups. Basically an enhanced disclosure on a rolling scheme that once you are on, you're on it for life.

In a nutshell, if you've done something stupid in the past, your prospective employer will know about it, and should one do something stupid that warrants the attention of the Law / Courts, your employer is informed immediately.

As an aside, those considering care work - it's not all sitting drinking cups of tea & chatting about the good old days - the job can be difficult but highly rewarding too - not everyone can do it, - imagine for a minute you're tending to someone with dementia.

Them - "When do you finish today?"
You "10pm"
Them - "My, that's a long day"

2 minutes later
Them - "When do you finish today?"
You - (in EXACTLY the same tone) - "10pm"
Them - "My, that's a long day."

2 minutes later
Them "When do........

Very rewarding job though.

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boff180
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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by boff180 »

verreli wrote:
Mon 13 Jul 2020, 9:13 pm
boff180 wrote:
Mon 13 Jul 2020, 7:28 pm
Where the hell are all these magic willing workers going to come from?
Care work is unskilled; I'd give it a go if it was a choice between that and claiming benefits. In a couple of months time furlough will end and a million plus low skilled shop assistants, restaurant staff, etc will enter the job market. The jobs they came from are highly unlikely to return. Covid-19 was the catalyst for a profound global economic change. Many will have to make some stark choices about how to pay the bills. I suggest they consider care work and get in early !
So, in a sector where being passionate about caring for people is important for the level of care being provided - you want any one to be a carer for the sake of having a job. I wouldn't want my relatives being looked after by someone who is only there to avoid being unemployed.

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Wrexham Mackem
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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by Wrexham Mackem »

verreli wrote:
Mon 13 Jul 2020, 9:13 pm
boff180 wrote:
Mon 13 Jul 2020, 7:28 pm
Where the hell are all these magic willing workers going to come from?
Care work is unskilled; I'd give it a go if it was a choice between that and claiming benefits.
You what?!?! visit the care home where my mum lives, and dare to tell me those people are unskilled. In fact, even without seeing the work they do up close, any person, any thinking person, can see that caring is a skill.

About the most ignorant post I've ever seen on UKAR Verelli. You are a disgrace.
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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by MiG_Eater »

Wrexham, totally understand your outrage as its clear that the wonderful work many people do in care home takes a huge amount of compassion, care and an almost endless supply of effort. I can also understand Verreli's point in that to work as a carer doesn't require any particular educational attainment and can therefore equally be classed as 'unskilled'. I have no educational attainment past high school myself, and therefore its true to say any work I do must, by definition, by 'unskilled' - but equally, I have a good job and am proud of the work I do.

I think this might be a disagreement in terms, rather than a lack of respect to carers. Incidentally, i'd love to work in care if the pay was better.

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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by phreakf4 »

MiG_Eater wrote:........ I have no educational attainment past high school myself, and therefore its true to say any work I do must, by definition, by 'unskilled'.....
Are you saying that only those who have been through "higher education" can be classed as "skilled workers"?

If that is so then I have for nearly fifty years been falsely claiming to be a "skilled" sheet metal worker. I would imagine there are many in other occupations (such as car mechanics, for example) who would also take issue with that statement.
nothing is confirmed at a show until its u/c hits the tarmac or it is running in for its display.....

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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by starbuck »

boff180 wrote:
Tue 14 Jul 2020, 7:13 am
verreli wrote:
Mon 13 Jul 2020, 9:13 pm
boff180 wrote:
Mon 13 Jul 2020, 7:28 pm
Where the hell are all these magic willing workers going to come from?
Care work is unskilled; I'd give it a go if it was a choice between that and claiming benefits. In a couple of months time furlough will end and a million plus low skilled shop assistants, restaurant staff, etc will enter the job market. The jobs they came from are highly unlikely to return. Covid-19 was the catalyst for a profound global economic change. Many will have to make some stark choices about how to pay the bills. I suggest they consider care work and get in early !
So, in a sector where being passionate about caring for people is important for the level of care being provided - you want any one to be a carer for the sake of having a job. I wouldn't want my relatives being looked after by someone who is only there to avoid being unemployed.
Like people from Eastern Europe or the Phillipines then?

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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by iainpeden »

boff180 wrote:
Mon 13 Jul 2020, 7:28 pm

Where the hell are all these magic willing workers going to come from?
Hong Kong - for where the government has done the honourable thing and offered sanctuary to the citizens holding the relevant passports.
(Mark Twain: There are lies, there are damn lies and then there are statistics)

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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by verreli »

It appears, yet again, that some people just don't get it. On the one hand they want unrestricted un-skilled immigration to fill ongoing vacancies and on the other argue that it requires a skill set - that's nonsense; you can't have it both ways. All jobs needs training, even the most basic. The distinction between a skilled and an unskilled job is that for some jobs, most will be able to do it with a little training (unskilled) and other jobs, very few are able to do it competently, no matter how much training is given (skilled). Like it or not, care work falls under the former but that doesn't mean the people performing the role don't have skill in what they are doing. This is the difference between a macro and micro perspective. I actually believe that in the next 30 years many of these roles will be displaced by AI robotics which presents a future problem. In the near term though, we have an increasing number of unemployed people (4 million by 2022) who need to put food on the table and a role that needs doing.

You'll probably also be pleased to hear that care work isn't part of my near term career ambition. But never say never.

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Re: The UKAR politics thread

Post by Mooshie1956 »

phreakf4 wrote:
Tue 14 Jul 2020, 8:36 am
MiG_Eater wrote:........ I have no educational attainment past high school myself, and therefore its true to say any work I do must, by definition, by 'unskilled'.....
Are you saying that only those who have been through "higher education" can be classed as "skilled workers"?

If that is so then I have for nearly fifty years been falsely claiming to be a "skilled" sheet metal worker. I would imagine there are many in other occupations (such as car mechanics, for example) who would also take issue with that statement.
In fairness I would suspect that you did do higher education in going to a tech college. I know as a fully qualified Motor vehicle Technician ( not sure if they still do technician and mechanic nowadays)and part qualified to IMI standard I did a lot of course work at a college, over a 6 year period.
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