The UKAR politics thread

Who will you vote for?

Poll ended at Wed 30 Oct 2019, 5:46 pm

Conservatives
56
43%
Labour
9
7%
SNP
5
4%
Lib Dems
44
34%
DUP
1
1%
Sinn Féin
2
2%
The Independent Group for Change
1
1%
Plaid Cymru
1
1%
The Green Party
3
2%
Nigel Fromage's latest project of stupidness
7
5%
 
Total votes : 129

Re: 2019 General Election

Postby rockfordstone on Fri 06 Dec 2019, 7:14 am

Finningley Boy wrote:
rockfordstone wrote:
Finningley Boy wrote:
Brevet Cable wrote:Can't answer for 'rockfordstone', but as you include me.....

Brexit?
It hasn't happened yet, so who's to say whether it was fear-mongering or not.

The Conservative Party?
Nope, more their leadership.....in which case, personal vitriol regarding BoJo for so many reasons that it would fill a book ( and May for being the second most useless PM ever - behind BoJo, of course )
If they actually had a decent leader I think more people would vote for them.

The Brexit Party ( and by extension, the earlier Farage cult which is UKIP )?
Out and out personal vitriol, and I make no apologies for it.

You'll also notice that I've slagged off Welsh Labour for being a bunch of useless, inept wastrels who waste money like it's going out of fashion.


Oh, and to turn things on their head, I'd say you're just as guilty when it comes to the Labour Party in general and Corbyn in particular.

With regard to you first response about Brexit. That's exactly the point, Rockfordstone, has attacked Southendnick for scaremongering about a Corbyn Government. He also got quite personal with some comment about whether he's a genuine individual or some kind of automaton or something like that. I've noticed with all the left leaning posters on here, they are invariably offensive posters, in one way or another. If it isn't responses such as Rockfordstone's, it'll be to question the rationale of the poster, quite deliberately.
But I'll stand by my own position, a Corbyn government would be bloody dreadful. Their spending plans alone couldn't be met without excessive borrowing and fa reaching cuts in other departments which don't traditionally enjoy much support or prominence with the left. I wonder who that might be?

FB

ok. I'll bite.

it was hardly an "attack". I didn't call him an automation, I called him a parody. perhaps you should read a bit more before responding. I'm sure he isn't fragile enough that it has upset him, but everything he posts is either an attack on labour or it is rolling out the tired old tropes.

As for my objectivity? well, I don't stand behind the cons or labour. the fact that the choice is between Corbyn and Johnsons is a failure in our politics and frankly, either choice is terrifying. neither of them will get my suppor.

he does, of course, have the right to an opinion, but if you are going to post an opinion online then be prepared to have it called out.

and I didn't accuse him of scaremongering. I responded to his doom and gloom post (again bashing Corbyn) in the way that he and many other Brexit supporters have attacked remainers with all too often, "project fear". as usual, people have missed the humour in the need to be offended by something. snowflakes the lot of you....


I couldn't remember what you called Southendnick I only recall it wasn't at all charitable and I wasn't going to stop typing to discard the post to go back and check what you said exactly.
A failure in politics, because you don't like two of the party leaders? So what would be a success in politics?

FB :cuppa:


One where the choices aren't a liar with a history of Islamophobia who represents a party that has taken a dive to the right opposed by a party that isn't led by a liar with a history of anti-Semitism that has taken a dive to the left?

It's not about me liking the leaders, it's more about both party options presented will ultimately leave us "Well, there's no need for that" one way or another.
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Re: 2019 General Election

Postby Tommy on Fri 06 Dec 2019, 8:09 am

Finningley Boy wrote: I've noticed with all the left leaning posters on here, they are invariably offensive posters, in one way or another.


Are they really, though?

When you and I were having a heated exchange not long ago, I’m quite sure it was you who told me to “take my meds” whilst I did not need to resort to such childhoodery.

What else has there been? Remainiacs, remoaners, saboeteurs, enemies of the people, unpatriotic, snowflakes, surrendered, melts, Europhiles, terrorist sympathisers...

I’m quite sure it was someone on here (Virreli?) who compared Remainers to radicalised terrorists...

Idk, mate, but I think you’re wrong on that one.

The one anti-Brexit but deeply offensive person on here was DanO, and he’s now gone.

I think you misnome “offence” with “get under your skin” or even “prove you wrong and embarrass you”. Or maybe you don’t. I don’t know. :dunno:

But even if you’re right and some left wing people are offensive on here, is it really “all” of them? Of course not. Don’t tar everyone with the same brush. I wouldn’t say that about “all” right-wingers on here. There are plenty, like Starbuck, MiG_Eater, ExVulcanGC (or people like PB, Brevet, Rockford, Moshie, LNSE and a great many others on the other side) with whom one can have an intelligent and courteous clash of ideas, and they’re genuinely a pleasure to have a discussion with.
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Re: 2019 General Election

Postby Tommy on Fri 06 Dec 2019, 8:39 am

Pretty devvo:



Say what you like about Corbyn, Swindon et al (and there’s plenty to say). At least they weren’t cowardly enough to dodge the interview.
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Re: 2019 General Election

Postby starbuck on Fri 06 Dec 2019, 10:48 am

Tommy wrote:Pretty devvo:



Say what you like about Corbyn, Swindon et al (and there’s plenty to say). At least they weren’t cowardly enough to dodge the interview.


Totally agree.

Ps I’m a big Andrew Neil fan and as good as he is I think interviewing Swindon might be a step too far for the great man. :grin:
starbuck

Re: 2019 General Election

Postby MiG_Eater on Fri 06 Dec 2019, 12:17 pm

Oh my word... absolutely savage!
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Re: 2019 General Election

Postby Southendnick on Fri 06 Dec 2019, 12:31 pm

Anyone know if this is true? Its been doing the rounds on social media this morning:

I WOULD LIKE TO CONGRATULATE JO SWINSON ON WINNING HER CASE AGAINST THE SNP SO SHE COULD STOP THE GENERAL PUBLIC KNOWING SHE RECEIVED £14,000 FROM A FRACKING COMPANY BOSS DESPITE HER CLAIMING TO BE AGAINST FRACKING.

I AM SURE THE FACT SHE RECEIVED £14,000 FROM A FRACKING COMPANY BOSS DOES NOT AFFECT HER OPPOSITION TO FRACKING IN ANY WAY WHATSOEVER.
IF JO SWINSON WANTS TO ACCEPT £14,000 FROM THE BOSS OF A FRACKING COMPANY WHILST AT THE SAME TIME CLAIM SHE IS OPPOSED TO FRACKING THAT IS HER BUSINESS.
THE SNP CLAIMED THAT JO SWINSON WAS A HYPOCRITE BECAUSE SHE SAID SHE WAS AGAINST FRACKING YET RECEIVED £14,000 FROM A FRACKING COMPANY.
THEY WERE WRONG IN THE EYES OF THE COURTS.

JO SWINSON DID NOT RECEIVE £14,000 FROM A FRACKING COMPANY.

JO SWINSON RECEIVED £14,000 FROM A FRACKING COMPANY BOSS.

THERE IS A MASSIVE DIFFERENCE IN RECEIVING £14,000 FROM A FRACKING COMPANY AND RECEIVING £14,000 FROM A FRACKING COMPANY BOSS. THAT IS NOT A TECHNICALITY AS SOME MIGHT SUGGEST BUT CLEAR LOGIC.

ANYWAY, NOW THAT JO SWINSON HAS WON HER COURT BATTLE WITH THE SNP IN ORDER TO STOP THEM REVEALING THAT SHE RECEIVED £14,000 FROM A FRACKING COMPANY OR A FRACKING COMPANY BOSS WHILST CLAIMING TO BE AGAINST FRACKING NO ONE WILL KNOW THAT SHE RECEIVED £14,000 FROM A FRACKING COMPANY BOSS BECAUSE IT IS NO ONES BUSINESS BUT HERS.

WELL DONE JO AND YOUR INTEGRITY REMAINS IN TACT BECAUSE YOU PREVENTED THE SNP FROM ISSUING LEAFLETS THAT CLAIM YOU RECEIVED £14,000 FROM A FRACKING COMPANY OR A FRACKING COMPANY BOSS WHILST YOU WERE CLAIMING TO BE AGAINST FRACKING.
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Re: 2019 General Election

Postby LN Strike Eagle on Fri 06 Dec 2019, 12:40 pm

Well, whoever posted it couldn't master the shift key, so there's the first warning flag...
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Re: 2019 General Election

Postby Brevet Cable on Fri 06 Dec 2019, 12:44 pm

I THINK YOU NEED TO CHECK YOUR KEYBOARD - YOUR CAPS LOCK KEY APPEARS TO BE STUCK DOWN !
:whistle:

IT'S NOT....err, sorry....
It's not eactly difficult to check, given that the case was even reported on the BBC website almost 2 weeks ago : https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50565209 and was first reported in the media back in June.

Maybe you should look into who the main donors of the Conservative & Brexit Parties are, too.
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Re: 2019 General Election

Postby Finningley Boy on Fri 06 Dec 2019, 2:18 pm

LN Strike Eagle wrote:Well, whoever posted it couldn't master the shift key, so there's the first warning flag...

I HAVE A SNEAKING SUSPICION HE DELIBERATELY TYPED ALL IN UPPER CASE TO MAKE A POINT?! DOUBTLESS THE CRITIQUES WOULD NOT BE SO CRITICAL IF HE DID THE SAME REPLACING STURGEON WITH FARAGE AND SWINSON WITH JOHNSON.

FB :cuppa:
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Re: 2019 General Election

Postby Brevet Cable on Fri 06 Dec 2019, 2:27 pm

YES THEY WOULD.

And if you do an extremely simple and extremely quick search you'll find that it is merely a cut-and-paste of a Facebook post which was made in upper-case ( pretty standard practice for faecesbook posters ) not something that SEN actually typed up himself.
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Re: 2019 General Election

Postby Brevet Cable on Fri 06 Dec 2019, 5:19 pm

starbuck wrote:
Tommy wrote:Pretty devvo:

Say what you like about Corbyn, Swindon et al (and there’s plenty to say). At least they weren’t cowardly enough to dodge the interview.


Totally agree.

Ps I’m a big Andrew Neil fan and as good as he is I think interviewing Swindon might be a step too far for the great man. :grin:


What would make me laugh is if BoJo & Corbyn were in the studio all set up for tonight's debate....then 'Brillo' walked in saying he'll be chairing it instead of Nick Robinson :lol:
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Re: 2019 General Election

Postby Southendnick on Fri 06 Dec 2019, 7:13 pm

Finningley Boy wrote:
LN Strike Eagle wrote:Well, whoever posted it couldn't master the shift key, so there's the first warning flag...

I HAVE A SNEAKING SUSPICION HE DELIBERATELY TYPED ALL IN UPPER CASE TO MAKE A POINT?! DOUBTLESS THE CRITIQUES WOULD NOT BE SO CRITICAL IF HE DID THE SAME REPLACING STURGEON WITH FARAGE AND SWINSON WITH JOHNSON.

FB :cuppa:



Actually it was cut and paste as I couldn't be arsed to re-do it all in lower case
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Re: 2019 General Election

Postby Southendnick on Fri 06 Dec 2019, 7:13 pm

Finningley Boy wrote:
LN Strike Eagle wrote:Well, whoever posted it couldn't master the shift key, so there's the first warning flag...

I HAVE A SNEAKING SUSPICION HE DELIBERATELY TYPED ALL IN UPPER CASE TO MAKE A POINT?! DOUBTLESS THE CRITIQUES WOULD NOT BE SO CRITICAL IF HE DID THE SAME REPLACING STURGEON WITH FARAGE AND SWINSON WITH JOHNSON.

FB :cuppa:



Actually it was cut and paste as I couldn't be arsed to re-do it all in lower case
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Boris fans please watch this...

Postby tankbuster on Fri 06 Dec 2019, 7:50 pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjUWX6S8iYU&t=0s

...and then tell me anything that JP says that is wrong or a lie.
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Re: 2019 General Election

Postby Finningley Boy on Fri 06 Dec 2019, 9:04 pm

rockfordstone wrote:
Finningley Boy wrote:
rockfordstone wrote:
Finningley Boy wrote:
Brevet Cable wrote:Can't answer for 'rockfordstone', but as you include me.....

Brexit?
It hasn't happened yet, so who's to say whether it was fear-mongering or not.

The Conservative Party?
Nope, more their leadership.....in which case, personal vitriol regarding BoJo for so many reasons that it would fill a book ( and May for being the second most useless PM ever - behind BoJo, of course )
If they actually had a decent leader I think more people would vote for them.

The Brexit Party ( and by extension, the earlier Farage cult which is UKIP )?
Out and out personal vitriol, and I make no apologies for it.

You'll also notice that I've slagged off Welsh Labour for being a bunch of useless, inept wastrels who waste money like it's going out of fashion.


Oh, and to turn things on their head, I'd say you're just as guilty when it comes to the Labour Party in general and Corbyn in particular.

With regard to you first response about Brexit. That's exactly the point, Rockfordstone, has attacked Southendnick for scaremongering about a Corbyn Government. He also got quite personal with some comment about whether he's a genuine individual or some kind of automaton or something like that. I've noticed with all the left leaning posters on here, they are invariably offensive posters, in one way or another. If it isn't responses such as Rockfordstone's, it'll be to question the rationale of the poster, quite deliberately.
But I'll stand by my own position, a Corbyn government would be bloody dreadful. Their spending plans alone couldn't be met without excessive borrowing and fa reaching cuts in other departments which don't traditionally enjoy much support or prominence with the left. I wonder who that might be?

FB

ok. I'll bite.

it was hardly an "attack". I didn't call him an automation, I called him a parody. perhaps you should read a bit more before responding. I'm sure he isn't fragile enough that it has upset him, but everything he posts is either an attack on labour or it is rolling out the tired old tropes.

As for my objectivity? well, I don't stand behind the cons or labour. the fact that the choice is between Corbyn and Johnsons is a failure in our politics and frankly, either choice is terrifying. neither of them will get my suppor.

he does, of course, have the right to an opinion, but if you are going to post an opinion online then be prepared to have it called out.

and I didn't accuse him of scaremongering. I responded to his doom and gloom post (again bashing Corbyn) in the way that he and many other Brexit supporters have attacked remainers with all too often, "project fear". as usual, people have missed the humour in the need to be offended by something. snowflakes the lot of you....


I couldn't remember what you called Southendnick I only recall it wasn't at all charitable and I wasn't going to stop typing to discard the post to go back and check what you said exactly.
A failure in politics, because you don't like two of the party leaders? So what would be a success in politics?

FB :cuppa:


One where the choices aren't a liar with a history of Islamophobia who represents a party that has taken a dive to the right opposed by a party that isn't led by a liar with a history of anti-Semitism that has taken a dive to the left?

It's not about me liking the leaders, it's more about both party options presented will ultimately leave us "Well, there's no need for that" one way or another.


So the failure you point to is the media exposure of anti-Semitism and islamophobia? Well you have other options of course. All you have to remember is; it doesn't matter what the chances of winning are with regards to smaller parties. One reason they remain so small and under represented is because of the nationwide resignation to the misleading philosophy, 'I'd vote Green but they don't stand a chance and I don't want to waste my vote!' So what the person who thinks this is doomed to do, is waste their vote.
They'll waste it by voting brainlessly for a traditionally big party because they might win??????????????????????? :dizzy: Therefore rendering their first choice a non-starter, because they 'didn't want to waste their vote. I am not of course accusing you of this illogical mind set. But everybody has the option to rectify matters, providing they understand, that there are no Bonuses for voting for a party simply because they are routinely successful, likewise, nobody will be taken into the woods and shot for voting for a party that goes no where! But you will have the peace of mind that you did the right thing!! :smile:

FB :cuppa:
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Re: 2019 General Election

Postby LN Strike Eagle on Fri 06 Dec 2019, 9:15 pm

Do you have to quote 800 posts every time you reply?
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Re: 2019 General Election

Postby Finningley Boy on Fri 06 Dec 2019, 9:27 pm

LN Strike Eagle wrote:Do you have to quote 800 posts every time you reply?

Sorry Sir. :sad:
Which post should have been the final one? :oops: Bearing in mind the one immediately prior wasn't mine.

FB :cuppa:
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Re: 2019 General Election

Postby LN Strike Eagle on Fri 06 Dec 2019, 9:30 pm

The one you're responding to?
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Re: 2019 General Election

Postby Brevet Cable on Sat 07 Dec 2019, 2:25 pm

No comments on last night's 'debate', then?
Or did everyone find it as mind-numbing as I did?
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Re: 2019 General Election

Postby pbeardmore on Sat 07 Dec 2019, 2:40 pm

Watched the 1st 30 mins of debate and changed channel to watch celebs eating Kangaroo penis in the jungle as there was more dignity and truth there,

BJ is just a walking cliche and there to be rideculed and torn apart but JC simply does not have the tools to do the job.
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Re: 2019 General Election

Postby Brevet Cable on Sat 07 Dec 2019, 3:06 pm

Listening to Radio 4 afterwards ( because the post-debate phone-in on Radio 5 seemed to have attracted all the Friday night moon-howlers & brasso-drinkers....and I think Stephen Nolan's a tosser at the best of times ) they had one of the people who was an advisor to the Leave campaign pre-referendum.
His opinion was that you could argue BoJo did well because he did exactly what was being taught during the referendum - stick to repeating the same soundbites over and over regardless of what the actual question was or whether there's any truth in them.

It's a shame the BBC didn't replace Nick Robinson as the chairman because he was bloody useless.
Boris was allowed to ramble on without actually saying anything, and much of what he did say was claiming what Labour would do instead of saying what the Conservatives will do ( and chuntering away in the background when Corbyn was speaking ) and neither of them was really challenged on the claims they were making.
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Re: 2019 General Election

Postby Brevet Cable on Sat 07 Dec 2019, 4:53 pm

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Re: 2019 General Election

Postby rockfordstone on Sun 08 Dec 2019, 12:43 am

Brevet Cable wrote:No comments on last night's 'debate', then?
Or did everyone find it as mind-numbing as I did?

honestly, I went to the pub and got smashed instead.
I'm gonna guess, everything that Boris said was "and that's why we need to get Brexit done so we can unleash the nations potential" and everything that Corbyn said was "I'm not going to apologise for anything but I will make it look like I have or something"

I bet the consensus at the end was that it was a draw and we learnt nothing. the Brexit bunch will still vote Boris and the corbynistas will be all like "but Jeremy is perfect and everything"?

I heard Jo Swinson on the radio the other day, and never in my life have I seen so many leaders who are so unsuitable to run our country... it's depressing
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Re: 2019 General Election

Postby verreli on Sun 08 Dec 2019, 12:52 pm

rockfordstone wrote:I'm gonna guess, everything that Boris said was "and that's why we need to get Brexit done so we can unleash the nations potential" and everything that Corbyn said was "I'm not going to apologise for anything but I will make it look like I have or something"

I bet the consensus at the end was that it was a draw and we learnt nothing. the Brexit bunch will still vote Boris and the corbynistas will be all like "but Jeremy is perfect and everything"?

I heard Jo Swinson on the radio the other day, and never in my life have I seen so many leaders who are so unsuitable to run our country... it's depressing


Nailed it !

We obviously need a change to the political status quo so who's voting for the Reform Party in 2024?
verreli

Re: 2019 General Election

Postby Brevet Cable on Sun 08 Dec 2019, 3:38 pm

Yep, from his opening statement to his closing statement the most oft-repeated soundbite from BoJo was "get Brexit done" and his argument ( if you could call it that ) was that everything else is reliant on that happening.
That and spending more time slagging off Corbyn & saying what he claimed Labour was going to do instead of actually saying what his plans are.

Corbyn did his usual school-masterish thing and the opinion of many ( including Conservative supporters ) was that he came across as more statesmanlike....which, to be fair, isn't exactly difficult compared to Boris.

I bet the consensus at the end was that it was a draw and we learnt nothing. the Brexit bunch will still vote Boris and the corbynistas will be all like "but Jeremy is perfect and everything"?

Some said Boris 'won', some said Corbyn, so yes, effectively a draw.....and no, nothing new in anything which was said.
Some of the pro-Leave callers said they would have voted Conservative but they'll now vote TBP instead "because Boris is such a liar that you can't trust him", Labour pro-Leavers said they'd vote TBP "to get Brexit done" and because they'd never vote for Boris ( don't know how much to make of the fact that they specified Boris rather than the Conservative Party ) and other Labour voters said they'd consider voting LibDem because they don't like Corbyn.
That's ignoring those who said they'd vote Labour/Conservative simply because they're Labour/Conservative.

We obviously need a change to the political status quo so who's voting for the Reform Party in 2024?

As has been pointed out in a number of the politics programmes recently, if the number of people who can't be arsed to vote actually bothered to do so it could have a marked effect on the political status quo - in most seats, the number of people who didn't vote is more than the successful Party won by, and in a lot of Constituencies the number who didn't vote is more than voted for all the candidates combined.
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