Whelford End - spotting from pavement being blocked for 2018

[Gonzo230]

Some here should read Issue 8 of RA2335.

[Brevet Cable]

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/668371/RA2335_Issue_8.pdf

Should anyone wish to do so.

[IATthenRIAT]

So a reasonable solution would be for them to do what they have with keeping cars and people sepaerate (sencible) but still provide a way for the static to be seen even with a time frame put on individuals (It wouldn'y hurt if marshalls took a small fee off everyone wanting to view and photograph for a while.
Over the 5 main days they could possibly raise 2000 people x each day x 5 days at say £5 a head thats £50.000 extra revenue for RAFBF.

[verreli]

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/668371/RA2335_Issue_8.pdf

A good read. Thanks for posting. All seems rather sensible.

Secondary Spectators: EO should identify likely secondary spectator areas, take all reasonable steps to prevent secondary spectators gathering in high risk areas and record the mitigation taken. Prevention will not always be possible; in this case FDD should take all reasonable steps to inform secondary crowds of the risk to them.

[boff180]

In this case to prevent them gathering you close the footpath...

[iaint]

but still provide a way for the static to be seen even with a time frame put on individuals

Yup, pretty sure that happens already, it’s called a ticket and allows people in for a limited time on the Friday, Saturday and/or Sunday. 100% static can be viewed.

[steveb23]

What happens if you have a mental dissabilty illness and cant cope with a full day and all the crowds bunched together in the show, also you may not be able to plan things well in advance (may not have transport plans or friends/family) but camping and seeing the flying in a less crowded situation is fine, but you still want to see even for just a few moments (long enough to take a few shots of the static).
Does that mean somone like this is not entitled to still try to get thier best from a day out at RIAT.

Getting their best from RIAT would be using the disabled facilities in the show ground... ie the disabled enclosure which offers an uncrowded excellent view of the displays.

Besides the health and safety angle why should any punters watch a £40+ ticketed show for free anyways? If you want to enjoy the show, buy a ticket like everyone else. I don’t see where the problem is, unless this takes away some people’s free show. Which for the avoidance of doubt is absolutely fine by me.

[danspuggti]

Taking the airshow ‘safety’ argument out of it, isn’t it illegal to obstruct/block a public right of way?
Considering the footpath would be classed as a right of way and people just camped there watching the aircraft are obstructing/blocking it (thus requiring people to walk in the road to get past them) aren’t they breaking the law?

[jingernut]

What happens if you have a mental dissabilty illness and cant cope with a full day and all the crowds bunched together in the show, also you may not be able to plan things well in advance (may not have transport plans or friends/family) but camping and seeing the flying in a less crowded situation is fine, but you still want to see even for just a few moments (long enough to take a few shots of the static).
Does that mean somone like this is not entitled to still try to get thier best from a day out at RIAT.

Stay at home and watch the live stream. Forget about the statics.

[MiG_Eater]

Wow jingernut that's pretty insensitive.

To be fair, in a situation like the one described i'd suggest wandering around the statics and finding a spot wayyyyyyyyyyyy west along the crowdline. Normally pretty sparsely populated.

[Dan213]

Taking the airshow ‘safety’ argument out of it, isn’t it illegal to obstruct/block a public right of way?
Considering the footpath would be classed as a right of way and people just camped there watching the aircraft are obstructing/blocking it (thus requiring people to walk in the road to get past them) aren’t they breaking the law?

No. Applications can be made to close or divert a public right of way on the grounds of there being a ‘likelihood of danger to the public”

[jingernut]

Wow jingernut that's pretty insensitive.

[danspuggti]

Taking the airshow ‘safety’ argument out of it, isn’t it illegal to obstruct/block a public right of way?
Considering the footpath would be classed as a right of way and people just camped there watching the aircraft are obstructing/blocking it (thus requiring people to walk in the road to get past them) aren’t they breaking the law?

No. Applications can be made to close or divert a public right of way on the grounds of there being a ‘likelihood of danger to the public”

Yes I know they can apply to divert a public right of way like you say but I didn’t mean this ‘official’ restriction.
What I meant was in previous years where nothing has been put in place and people were physically blocking the footpath. We’re those people not breaking the law by obstructing/blocking the public right of way?

[Mooshie1956]

Sometimes people need to be protected from themselves, that's what a responsible society does. Within reason of course.

I wonder how many people in human existence have been killed by an aircraft on approach? Is it even one?

For a starter look up Stockport Air disaster in 1967.

[IATthenRIAT]

Stay at home and watch the live stream. Forget about the statics.

Same affect as you attending the show without any camera and having to use a throw away kodak thing.

[IATthenRIAT]

The organisers are not using there heads over this - they should turn it into a possitive, and make some revenue from it, in the field they are intending to use for the temporary footpath if its marshalled why not turn it into a vantage point (NOT) right under the runway say a couple of hundread yards each side, they could trim the headge row, possibly put in a few pallet stacks, and throw in a few fast food vans and a couple of loos.

Come on RIAT RAFBF wake up, this would raise some serious extra income you Wont be getting without thease measures, and everyone wins.

[jingernut]

The organisers are not using there heads over this - they should turn it into a possitive, and make some revenue from it, in the field they are intending to use for the temporary footpath if its marshalled why not turn it into a vantage point (NOT) right under the runway say a couple of hundread yards each side, they could trim the headge row, possibly put in a few pallet stacks, and throw in a few fast food vans and a couple of loos.

Come on RIAT RAFBF wake up, this would raise some serious extra income you Wont be getting without thease measures, and everyone wins.

You do know that Park and View exists already right?

[Dan213]

Taking the airshow ‘safety’ argument out of it, isn’t it illegal to obstruct/block a public right of way?
Considering the footpath would be classed as a right of way and people just camped there watching the aircraft are obstructing/blocking it (thus requiring people to walk in the road to get past them) aren’t they breaking the law?

No. Applications can be made to close or divert a public right of way on the grounds of there being a ‘likelihood of danger to the public”

Yes I know they can apply to divert a public right of way like you say but I didn’t mean this ‘official’ restriction.
What I meant was in previous years where nothing has been put in place and people were physically blocking the footpath. We’re those people not breaking the law by obstructing/blocking the public right of way?

I should imagine it’s technically illegal to do so but policing it is difficult. Driving past over the last few years I have only ever seen stewards and no police and unfortunately due to the younger nature of many of them, many of the older citizens feel that it’s within their right to ignore them. There was one guy I can recall who liked to shout about how he was allowed to stand in the middle of the footpath. Was incredibly rude and verbally abusive to the stewards that asked him to move on. Told them that he’d sue them because apparently he’d sued the stewards at Cottesmore for asking him to move.

It’s people like this that ruin it for everybody else.

[Dan213]

The organisers are not using there heads over this - they should turn it into a possitive, and make some revenue from it, in the field they are intending to use for the temporary footpath if its marshalled why not turn it into a vantage point (NOT) right under the runway say a couple of hundread yards each side, they could trim the headge row, possibly put in a few pallet stacks, and throw in a few fast food vans and a couple of loos.

Come on RIAT RAFBF wake up, this would raise some serious extra income you Wont be getting without thease measures, and everyone wins.

That’s what you buy a ticket for. If you want a lower cost option then there is park and view as others have said. Why should they go out of their way to set up an extra area outside the show ground? Besides, the nature of quite a number of people at the end of the runway is that they don’t want to pay a penny unfortunately.

[IATthenRIAT]

The organisers are not using there heads over this - they should turn it into a possitive, and make some revenue from it, in the field they are intending to use for the temporary footpath if its marshalled why not turn it into a vantage point (NOT) right under the runway say a couple of hundread yards each side, they could trim the headge row, possibly put in a few pallet stacks, and throw in a few fast food vans and a couple of loos.

Come on RIAT RAFBF wake up, this would raise some serious extra income you Wont be getting without thease measures, and everyone wins.

You do know that Park and View exists already right?

Im on about for example this year during the full show days - Fri, Sat, Sun and for those who do not have a car, but are staying at one of the campsites.

Its a Win Win situation for everyone.

[speedbird2639]

This announcement gets a massive from me - anything that RIAT (and any other air show for that matter) can do to clear away the entitled vermin that are secondary crowds is fine by me.

Long over due. If they use public safety as a flag of convenience to get this scourge eradicated then fair enough.

[IATthenRIAT]

The organisers are not using there heads over this - they should turn it into a possitive, and make some revenue from it, in the field they are intending to use for the temporary footpath if its marshalled why not turn it into a vantage point (NOT) right under the runway say a couple of hundread yards each side, they could trim the headge row, possibly put in a few pallet stacks, and throw in a few fast food vans and a couple of loos.

Come on RIAT RAFBF wake up, this would raise some serious extra income you Wont be getting without thease measures, and everyone wins.

That’s what you buy a ticket for. If you want a lower cost option then there is park and view as others have said. Why should they go out of their way to set up an extra area outside the show ground? Besides, the nature of quite a number of people at the end of the runway is that they don’t want to pay a penny unfortunately.

I respectfully think you are wrong, RIAT need to think outside the box and consider that there is a potential profit to be made from including some form of limited (small charge) viewing that is away from the road, ther will always be a large amount of people (I call 1-2000 a lot) who for waht ever reason can not go into the show (The reasons are not important) if an area was used and marshalled with vantage points over the static, I would pay £5 and bet all those who had that chance or nothing would too.

[IATthenRIAT]

I honestly think this needs encouraging and considering, its not in replacement but in addition to the show.

[MiG_Eater]

IATthenRIAT - genuinely - even at the busiest times - I have always found the far west of the airfield to be extremely sparsely populated. What you're suggesting is impractical for several reasons (not least because the displays often overfly the park and view areas) but the effect of being in the show but without the crowds of people around can be achieved in the show itself by taking a bit of a walk west.

[IATthenRIAT]

This announcement gets a massive from me - anything that RIAT (and any other air show for that matter) can do to clear away the entitled vermin that are secondary crowds is fine by me.

Long over due. If they use public safety as a flag of convenience to get this scourge eradicated then fair enough.

RIAT needs to move on and consider another angle going into the show or spotting from the outside are two completely seperate things.

If they used thier head they could generate a fair bit towards the show, "so called freeloaders" would not then be "freeloaders" but paying people with reduced facilities.